None of the races are foreigners to Tamriel. Just as none are foreign to Nirn which is why the statement is still nonsensical regardless of what you were actually trying to say. But lets move on from poor diction.
How about this if it will ease the syntactical comprehension of my statement; all races of provinces of Tamriel, are foreigners to each neighboring province. Besides... Tamriel is a planet... remember? Let's move on.
No it doesn't. By its etymology xenophobia means fear of what's strange or alien to a person. It's a biological impulse that served our ancestors well before civilization by causing them to approach all new things with caution lest it result in injury or death. Xenophobia and racism aren't mutually exclusive because xenophobia can be based exclusively on on a groups ethnicity or ancestry, it just may not necessarily be so. Regardless of whether it is solely, partially, or not at all race based it's no less irrational and therefore no more laudable than racism and in the end it does little to differentiate how one evaluates the character of a person, especially if the xenophobia is partially or wholly based on race or ancestry.
Unfortunately I did not request a verbose course in the etymology of a word which I have defined so plentifully in unique, but connected ways that anyone of any level of understanding could gather to what I referred. Onto it's Dictionary definition:
xen·o·pho·bi·a
[zen-uh-foh-bee-uh, zee-nuh-] Show IPA
noun
an unreasonable
fear or hatred of foreigners or strangers or of that
which is foreign or strange.
If my single use of "
basically means...
against,"
again, confused yours or anybody's understanding of the multiple different and connected methods of defining the word, then I apologize. It was assumed that you understood it. I'll just stick to "fearful" or "hateful" rather than the related "against," so that these large and needlessly verbose diversions can be apprehended. Although, as an addition you altered your entire argument by stating that since xenophobia has its own amoral basis it is no less sinister than racism. This
does alter how one views a character if one is aware of their separate definitions. If this did not matter, you would not cling so desperately to the argument that "he is racist" rather than, "he is xenophobic; possibly racist," because that disregards the premise of your content and the differences in the terms and to me, is the equivalent of conceding. You also disregard and/or confuse my argument; I never attempted to necessarily restore his character, whereas I simply stated that there is a vast confusion between racism and xenophobia in describing him and most "racist" characters in the game.
The Dunmer are segregated because of their race. The Altmer, Breton, and Imperial citizens of Windhelm are no less foreign to the city thant the Dunmer. Claiming that non race based xenophobia is the basis for their treatment is roughly the equivalent of claiming that the racism displayed by the conservative elements in the United States against Hispanics isn't racism even though Hispanics have been well established and integrated into American society for hundreds of years.
Firstly, the Nords' distrust for Elvenkind appears to be blatantly more deep than any human species. With that being said, there is a single High Elf citizen who says when asked,
"Are you treated as badly as the Dark Elves?" she replies by saying
"It was difficult at first. The Nords of this city are, at best, suspicious of outsiders. But in time I made the right friends and proved myself useful enough that they don't give me trouble anymore. The Dunmer are too proud and naive to see the way things truly are, and so they continue to dwell in that slum." I'll ignore the political insertion and premise. Step off that soapbox; it's a video game forum.
Nothing in the game suggests that a cultural divide is what motivates the racial segregation of the Dunmer. The game content suggests the contrary as the mere segregation of the Dunmer with what basically amounts to their sleeping arrangements does absolutely nothing to comfort a distrust of outside cultures. The Dunmer are free to roam about Windhelm spreading their non-existent cultural contamination to the non-existent dismay of the local Nord population irrespective of the segregation policy. This is also why the statement:
Something needs to be addressed;
Ulfric doesn't seem openly hateful of any elf. He seems more neglectful of them during this time of war then anything. Their seclusion to the "Gray" Quarter seems more instrumented by the Nords of the city, than Ulfric himself (who is blind to the plight of non-Nords). Despite that argument itself, Niranye, the Altmer citizen from before, claims it is their fault for sticking to that slum.
Is an equally toothless notion. Putting aside the fact that the Nords have not been historically suspicious of Dunmer (if anything the opposite is true because the Nords have a history of being aggressors against Morrowind, invading it several times without provocation) suspicious of what? The residential restriction does absolutely nothing to comfort suspicions that any Nord might harbor that the Dunmer may be doing something untrustworthy, as evidenced by the words of Rolff Stone-fist when you first enter through the front gates of the city.
Oh...no... my notion has no teeth.... Nords have been historically suspicious of Elves. The time of war brought upon by an Elven Dominion also suggests that mere distrust may have evolved into revulsion and paranoia.
You mean the nonexistent ingame non-race based xenophobia you've been advocating by pointing at nothing other than your speculation while trying to dismiss away game content that contradicts the same?
You have not provided solid evidence that this game provides undeniable content that contradicts my observation. If you haven't noticed, that's why I'm bothering to deconstruct your argument in the first place. In fact, again, you said,
Regardless of whether it is solely, partially, or not at all race based it's no less irrational and therefore no more laudable than racism and in the end it does little to differentiate how one evaluates the character of a person, especially if the xenophobia is partially or wholly based on race or ancestry.
which does nothing but help my argument by admitting that it is possible there may be no race based xenophobia at all.
Then why list ones that are readily dismissed by the lore and require you to ignore it?
Again; false premise in conjunction with two people debating and deconstructing each others' arguments. I'll accept that these are "readily dismissed" when I've been convinced that you're, without a doubt, right and that Ulfric is an absolute filthy racist (as opposed to a haughty nationalist).
The Stormcloaks as individuals may not even harbor any particularly xenophibic or racist characterisitics. Some may be fighting solely to end the rampage of the Thalmor in Skyrim and to reestablish the open worship of Talos. Notwithstanding that, because they choose to pledge their fealty to Ulfric, they're beholden to enforce his will. All of it, including what they might consider bad, along with what they may believe to be good and right.
Thank goodness I don't see Ulfric as a "racist".
That kind of xenophobia is only sustainable as racism. Unless you consider the multi-generational antisemitism of islamist extremists or the multi-generational anti-everything not white of the Aryan Nation and its ilk to be non race based xenophobia, your distinction is empty and meaningless. I challenge you to present one example of multigenerational xenophobia that doesn't rely upon hatred of either ethnicity or ancestry to sustain itself.
Pointing out that the positions of....
I will admit, however not concede, that there do appear to be some "racist" (I use this term rather lightly as the power of the term is divided each time it is used too aimlessly) members of the Nordic race. There appear to be "racist" members of Imperials(including Tullius and his disrespect for the "culture" of the Nords, which you yourself admit is so attached to the people that it is inevitably an event of racism), Bretons, High Elves, Dark Elves, Khajiit; you name it. It just so happens that this game is mirroring an imaginary medieval culture that also happened to have "racism" and xenophobia rampant. However, I see Ulfric as one of the less
hateful of other groups, despite being of the most
neglectful and ignorant of them and their plight; his attention is to this war.
...his ignoring what the game presents to him and fabricating his own independent alternative and contradictory version of what is going on in the game aren't perusasive and don't refute the actual existence of racist characteristics of an NPC in the game isn't obsessive regardless of puerile attempts to claim it as such. If you don't like the idea of having your subjective opinions that are borne purely by your inner speculations picked apart as such when you try to advocate that they are anything more than that then don't post them. Otherwise they're fair game for open criticism.
It's your
obsessive idea that I'm ignoring the content rather than gathering from it my own experience and case of debate. It's
astonishing that I have gravitated towards a conclusion unique to yours in this "gray" realm of morality! I don't accept the premise that you put out; half of your content revolves around this imaginary premise unfortunately. I don't mind the idea of my subjective opinions, (subjective, like yours) which are developed from my personal experience and understanding of this situation, being "criticized"; you know, the
content displayed. I understand the point of a debate. What you happen to include is mockery of my intelligence, my functionality as an adult sentient thinker and my ability to grasp
anything (because of a video game, no less). This is incredibly pretentious, and although it doesn't bother me, I certainly won't refrain from pointing it out. If you are not able to accept the criticism of your
mature and utterly necessary (to the argument) attacks on my intelligence (which you definitely seemed to rescind, for your own good), then please take your own advice.
