Imperials or Stormcloaks, what one?

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DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
Your faith in the Empire is commendable, DM. To say the least. I sincerely hope Beth doesn't let you down in the end... TES VI and all.

I support the Empire over the Stormcloaks. Not that I truly find the Third Empire in TES to be a great thing, they have a great many flaws.

Take the Stormcloak rebellion, for years it raged. With talks of skirmishes occurring years ago, which would mean Skyrim's holds were fighting each other. The Empire did nothing, Hammerfell had infighting also, the Empire did nothing.

It was only Torygg's death that made the Legion step in to stop the bloodshed.
 

setsua

New Member
The Thalmor benefit from a long drawn out conflict. They don't want either side to win, since the longer it draws out the weaker the Empire becomes.

Sounds like an interesting RP. I once had an Imperial who would travel with the executioner from Solitude, clearing out forts and caves. Bringing the Emperor's justice to the lawless.

tumblr_mh012mf1ds1s3wb20o1_500.gif

I'm trying to RP were we are a secret rising faction within the Thalmor. We don't believe in how the thalmor are in this era, sure we still think we are above most if your pure blood BUT if you have high elf blood you can live among us as equals. We don't like the stormcloaks as much mostly because they seem like thalmor but with nords. If in the end our plans fail we will join the Empire.

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Rimfaxe96

Well-Known Member
If you have the slightest difference of bloodline, you die.

At that point I wonder, how do they determinate whose bloodline is impure and whose isn't? Can't do things like blood tests or DNA tests (yet? Lol.). Political opponents are easy to call impure and kill off, but the "true" mixed folks...? Can't imagine that as long as their ears are the right shape etc.

"For the Empire! For the Legion!" - Tullius

Whoever created that shot did an incredibly good job. Thanks for sharing. :eek:
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
At that point I wonder, how do they determinate whose bloodline is impure and whose isn't? Can't do things like blood tests or DNA tests (yet? Lol.). Political opponents are easy to call impure and kill off, but the "true" mixed folks...? Can't imagine that as long as their ears are the right shape etc.

Well you have elves who are hundreds to thousands of years old. Also the Empire and many provinces keep records of marriages, births etc. So reading records wouldn't be too hard, nor would lying about who should die.

Also yes, the Thalmor do also kill any who oppose them. They once needed the crowd and had to lie as reasons to go against people. They now rule through fear, and an iron fist. Slaughtering many Altmer and Bosmer at will.
 

Papoy

DON'T EXPECT SPOILER WARNINGS FROM ME
If you will read my history on this forum, you will see I am never the person who starts. However, I am often the person who ends it.

You left out the part where you summon me to end it. :p

In the end war (no matter wich side you have chosen) Tallius admits that Thalmor controlls the emperor.

At the end of the Imperial questline, you hear talks of an upcoming war between the Empire and Thalmor. Well you hear about a second round of fighting before you start the Civil war quest line.

Most of the Legion is tied down on the border with the Aldmeri Dominion. The Emperor can't afford to risk weakening Cyrodiil's defenses. From the Imperial City, our war here is just a sideshow. An interlude before the main event against the Thalmor resumes. - General Tullius

"He wasn't always a self-serving ego-maniac. He fought in the Imperial army in the War against the Dominion. But Ulfric and his "Stormcloaks" are deluding themselves. If there's any hope of a long term victory against the Dominion, it's in the Empire. The rebels are only inflaming the tension and weakening the Empire by distracting it from its ultimate aim." - Legate Rikke

"The ordinary citizen will be happy to get back to life as normal, to have their families return home. And they should enjoy it while they can... I suspect all of Tamriel will again be called to arms in the not too distant future." - Legate Rikke


Well i knew that i didn't count all the details probably becouse i wasn't paying much attention to speaking... listening to something same for 300 times annoyes me and i allmost never try to remember what i heard. Anyway thanks for fixing me.
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
But I remember when I was on that profile, I posted here, and I got attacked real bad, just because I agreed with the Empire.

Don't need to worry about that anymore. The Empire stands together, so we lot tend to band together and debate like a pack of wolves.
 

Papoy

DON'T EXPECT SPOILER WARNINGS FROM ME
OMG screw this empire and stormcloacks... companions are best.
 

Lord of Blood

High King Ulfric
I think the way Bethesda is going, the time of the Empire is over and each country in Tamriel will be independent eventually. I've noticed that the over time the Empire has been losing territory and weakening. Only Cyrodil, High Rock and Skyrim remain part of the Empire. If Ulfric did win then it won't be long before High Rock will be wanting it's independence as well. Nothing lasts forever, kingdoms rise and fall. The Redguards rejecting the White-Gold Concordat and successfully defending their borders for 5 years against the Dominion I believe was another inspiration of the Stormcloak Rebellion. And makes one truly believe that the a Dominion was just as weak and exhausted as the Empire was after the Imperial City was retaken. The Empire was weak when you started the game forcing them to have to recruit locally. Besides even if the Empire ceases to exist what makes you think each country in Tamriel still won't work together to confront the common threat that the Dominion poses to all? It would be foolish. A free and independent Skyrim would not have to face the Dominion alone, they not the only ones the Dominion wants to conquer. Also if you win Ulfric will then turn his attention towards strengthening Skyrim and preparing for the next great fight. Skyrim will lead the world in that fight and I believe other countries will follow their lead since only Skyrim had the nerve to stand up and fight for their freedom. A Stormcloak victory doesn't automatically spell doom for Skyrim as one might think.


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Snake-Brother282

The Saxhleel Slayer
I think the way Bethesda is going, the time of the Empire is over and each country in Tamriel will be independent eventually. I've noticed that the over time the Empire has been losing territory and weakening. Only Cyrodil, High Rock and Skyrim remain part of the Empire. If Ulfric did win then it won't be long before High Rock will be wanting it's independence as well. Nothing lasts forever, kingdoms rise and fall. The Redguards rejecting the White-Gold Concordat and successfully defending their borders for 5 years against the Dominion I believe was another inspiration of the Stormcloak Rebellion. And makes one truly believe that the a Dominion was just as weak and exhausted as the Empire was after the Imperial City was retaken. The Empire was weak when you started the game forcing them to have to recruit locally. Besides even if the Empire ceases to exist what makes you think each country in Tamriel still won't work together to confront the common threat that the Dominion poses to all? It would be foolish. A free and independent Skyrim would not have to face the Dominion alone, they not the only ones the Dominion wants to conquer. Also if you win Ulfric will then turn his attention towards strengthening Skyrim and preparing for the next great fight. Skyrim will lead the world in that fight and I believe other countries will follow their lead since only Skyrim had the nerve to stand up and fight for their freedom. A Stormcloak victory doesn't automatically spell doom for Skyrim as one might think.
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I disagree, the Empire has certainly weakened, but what makes you think that the time to cut and run is when you're needed most? Also it's a pipe dream to think that a Stormcloak ruled skyrim could lead the charge against anything, you have to factor in variables other than simple military strength. Does Skyrim have any allies other than the Empire? How long would it take Ulfric, who's responsible for destabilizing skyrim to begin with, to turn his dirty little militia into an army capable of standing against the Thalmor? How will Skyrim recover from the recent plague of dragons? The Empire supports Skyrim economically as well, without the cash, goods, and manpower flowing from the Empire, Skyrim would fall apart. There would be no money, little food, slavery, and the Nords would be forced to return to barbarism for survival, it's happened before.
 

Snake-Brother282

The Saxhleel Slayer
Also can someone Please explain to me: Just what the hell makes you Stormcloaks think that any other province would support your racist, xenophobic @sses? The Stormcloaks given time would be just a bad an option as the Thalmor! They also believe in racial superiority! Why would anyone other than The Empire come to Skyrim's aid? All you foolish thick-skulled Nords do is talk about "true sons and daughters of blah, blah, blah" but the saddest most frustrating part is that I've yet to meet a Stormcloak that knows what it means.
Who are the REAL Sons and Daughters of Skyrim? Skyrim's more than just spoiled Nords yelling catchphrases they don't understand.
 

Anouck

Queen of Procrastination
I think the way Bethesda is going, the time of the Empire is over and each country in Tamriel will be independent eventually. I've noticed that the over time the Empire has been losing territory and weakening. Only Cyrodil, High Rock and Skyrim remain part of the Empire. If Ulfric did win then it won't be long before High Rock will be wanting it's independence as well.

There are two big guys at the moment: the Empire and the Dominion. Choosing independence means you stand alone against the Thalmor. It is like general Tullius says: the Empire is what is keeping the Dominion out of Skyrim. It is the treaty that is a banner against the Thalmor invading the province. If you step out of the Empire, you step out of the treaty. No peace for you. The Thalmor can just invade your province, and I don't just mean Skyrim. The same thing goes for High Rock.

Nothing lasts forever, kingdoms rise and fall. The Redguards rejecting the White-Gold Concordat and successfully defending their borders for 5 years against the Dominion I believe was another inspiration of the Stormcloak Rebellion.

The Redguards refused to accept the White Gold Concordat. This was a threat to the Empire, who tried to stop a war they were obviously going to lose. They needed time to regain strength, and Hammerfell wasn't cooperating. Titus Mede II was forced to renounce Hammerfell as an Imperial province, and the province continued the fight.
"But the Redguards should not forget the great sacrifice of Imperial blood - Breton, Nord, and Cyrodilic - at the Battle of the Red Ring that weakened the Dominion enough to allow the eventual Second Treaty of Stros M'kai in 4E 180 and the withdrawal of Aldmeri forces from Hammerfell" - The Great War (book)

I wonder how long the Redguards can keep fighting against a Dominion that is growing more powerful every single day. One province can't possibly defend itself forever against something as big as the Aldmeri Dominion.
And the fact that the Redguards were able to do this, doesn't mean everyone is. According to that logic every province would be at the same strength. But I understand that the Stormcloaks found this inspirational.


And makes one truly believe that the a Dominion was just as weak and exhausted as the Empire was after the Imperial City was retaken. The Empire was weak when you started the game forcing them to have to recruit locally.


The Empire wasn't weak when you started the game. The moment you arrive at Helgen, there are also Legion forces standing at the Aldmeri Dominion's border, ready for the 2nd round. But yes, right after retaking the Imperial City the Dominion indeed was in no shape to continue the war.

Besides even if the Empire ceases to exist what makes you think each country in Tamriel still won't work together to confront the common threat that the Dominion poses to all?

Because politics. The reason why Imperial provinces fight alongside each other, is because each one of them is part of the Empire. They are bound by treaties and laws that make them one strong faction. Would you, if you were Hammerfell, give aid to Skyrim if you need every single soldier to defend your own borders? You can barely keep your own province safe, let alone another province. You have to understand independent provinces aren't bound by anything at all. They are not part of a bigger faction or organization. They have no obligation whatsoever to help you out.

It would be foolish. A free and independent Skyrim would not have to face the Dominion alone, they not the only ones the Dominion wants to conquer.

Agreed. Hence why we have to stick together.

Also if you win Ulfric will then turn his attention towards strengthening Skyrim and preparing for the next great fight.

Like you said before: an independent Skyrim shouldn't face the Dominion alone - yet that is most likely going to happen. What is the Stormcloak rebellion going to do against the Thalmor? And how did the Stormcloak strengthen Skyrim? They have been thinning out the population with their Civil War against the Legion. Thousands of men (Skyrim does not have a 1000 NPC's because that would be impossible to make, but you have to see this in perspective) died for that. An army force that was preparing to kick back against the Dominion had to fight the Stormcloaks too, which kept them from focusing for the full 100% on the Thalmor.

Skyrim will lead the world in that fight and I believe other countries will follow their lead since only Skyrim had the nerve to stand up and fight for their freedom.

No. Skyrim would not, like you yourself said, be the only independent province. Hammerfell is one, for instance. And there is no reason why other provinces would help you - unless you create a treaty or faction to unite all the independent provinces. But then you lose your independence too.
Uniting against the Dominion and independence are very contradicting. It is one or the other, for you can't have both.

A Stormcloak victory doesn't automatically spell doom for Skyrim as one might think.

You never know 100% what is going to happen. Things are either likely or unlikely to happen. An independent Skyrim, who largely depends on the Empire for food sources (independence means no food supply), doesn't stand a chance against the Dominion. You would be largely dependent on how helpful other provinces are going to be. They are not obligated to help you, and barely have the men to defend their own borders.
 

Anouck

Queen of Procrastination
I disagree, the Empire has certainly weakened, but what makes you think that the time to cut and run is when you're needed most? Also it's a pipe dream to think that a Stormcloak ruled skyrim could lead the charge against anything, you have to factor in variables other than simple military strength. Does Skyrim have any allies other than the Empire? How long would it take Ulfric, who's responsible for destabilizing skyrim to begin with, to turn his dirty little militia into an army capable of standing against the Thalmor? How will Skyrim recover from the recent plague of dragons? The Empire supports Skyrim economically as well, without the cash, goods, and manpower flowing from the Empire, Skyrim would fall apart. There would be no money, little food, slavery, and the Nords would be forced to return to barbarism for survival, it's happened before.

The Stormcloaks are very similar to the Thalmor - more than they like to think. What is the difference between two different kinds of discrimination? Saying that discriminating this group is worse than discriminating that group, is basically the foundation of discrimination. To me, seeing each race that isn't a Nord as inferior, is just as bad as thinking the Aldmer are superior.
I also wonder how many provinces are going to aid Skyrim. If I was Morrowind, I surely wouldn't help out the people that make my people live in slums. If you are planning to stick together, make sure you make the other provinces like you. Don't piss them off with your Nord supremacy bullplops, because they won't come to aid you.

Also, Nords always returned to barbarism in times where there was no centralized government. Jarls fought amongst each other and thinned out the population with rebellions and wars.
 

Anouck

Queen of Procrastination
I was just agreeing with Papoy that the Companions are better than the civil war line.

The quests? Definitely.. The CW questline sucked. :sadface:


Though it was supposed to be better. It wasn't and not cool either.

Apparently Bethesda had huge plans with the CW questline. I don't exactly remember it. DrunkenMage mentioned it before. Anyway, it was supposed to be bigger and better, but they had to leave it out because = deadline
 

Kat'ir

The Chill Of The Void
I haven't read through every post because I have a bloody life, however I from what I've seen no ones posted anything about the following

Ulrfric stormcloak's dossier in the embassy. If you care about taking mainland tamriel(all but summer set) from the thalmor join the imperials. If you want to play right into the thalmors plan, join the stormcloaks.

Don't even fl*ffing argue this post until you read and rehearsed the dossier on this discussion.

http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Thalmor_Dossier:_Ulfric_Stormcloak
 
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