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Are you a vegetarian, vegan, or meat eater?

  • Meat

    Votes: 33 97.1%
  • Vegetarian

    Votes: 1 2.9%
  • Vegan

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    34

Anouck

Queen of Procrastination
Just like to point out that meat isn't the only kind of produce made from animals. Unless one boycotts glue, leather, gelatin, etc. (or specifically searches out companies that do not use animal parts), they are still using things that animals were killed or forced to live in less than ideal conditions to produce. To lead a truly vegan lifestyle for ethical reasons, you have to be careful about a lot of the household and everyday products you use, not just what you eat.

If you just want people to admit that meat is murder, then yes, it's very unnecessary to eat meat. My uncle is a vegan for health reasons (his whole family is, actually, they just can't eat animal products at all) and they are all incredibly healthy and strong, and live long lives.

I personally can't live without meat though (figuratively speaking). I love my veggies, but I love steak, too.

I wish I could give you rep for that but somehow I can't ;)
You're totally right.. Even gummy bears contain pig bones. And when you drink milk you should know there's a calf slaughtered to get that milk.. That's why I consider being vegetarian as hypocrit. If you want to save animals you got to be a vegan
 

Karen

boop.
I wish I could give you rep for that but somehow I can't ;)
You're totally right.. Even gummy bears contain pig bones. And when you drink milk you should know there's a calf slaughtered to get that milk.. That's why I consider being vegetarian as hypocrit. If you want to save animals you got to be a vegan
Yeah, I know they mean well and I do think the sentiment behind ethical vegetarianism is very thoughtful, yet I can't stand it when some vegetarians get all "holier than thou" just because they don't eat meat (and I am looking at absolutely no one in this thread, so don't take offense in that statement), 'cause chances are, they probably use other things that were made from animal parts.

On a lighter note, this thread kinda reminded me of this:
 

FullmetalHeart20

Well-Known Member
I understand how many things can defeat the purpose of this lifestyle. I also understand that, until I gain access to health food stores and organic produce, I must do the best with what I have.
 

Medea

The Shadow Queen
I'd like to point out that those plant studies are bullpl***. Plants don't have a nervous system or brain, so it is impossible for them to think or feel. Their movements might as well function the same as a machine. They react to the world, but they don't feel it.
As for meat, if the raw stuff is so healthy than why do we cook it at all? Is fresh red meat really such a rarity? And who here can claim that hunting down, killing and eating an animal sounds pleasant? Or even easy?

I realize that plants don't have brains or a nervous system. I was basically being sarcastic with that statement.

And yes, fresh meat is a rarity. Most of our meat is processed and loaded with preservatives (much like most other food) so it won't spoil. It can take a week or longer for meat to reach a supermarket and even more time before a consumer actually prepares it for dinner. Plenty of people order their steak rare, even though it isn't recommended. Japanese people eat raw fish, because it's fresh (they live on an island nation so it doesn't have to go far before it is eaten).

As for hunting down an animal and killing it for sustenance, if you were starving to death and had to kill an animal for food, believe me, you could do it. Plus, how hard is it to point a gun at a defenseless animal and kill it? I'm not trying to sound heartless, but that's just the way it would be.
 

FullmetalHeart20

Well-Known Member
I'm not saying that I wouldn't eat meat to avoid starving. I believe in survival of the fittest. But we happen to live in a world where we can leave other animals out of that. If I need some protein, I'll take a few ounces of seitan over a chicken.
 

Benthos

Proud Mer
Humans have canines which are carnivorous teeth, we have always been omnivores like bears throughout human history, always have been hunters and gatherers; to denounce our diets throughout history by saying we're designed as herbivores is ignorant and misleading. To argue that living life as a vegetarian doesn't murder then sure, if you don't count plant and fungal life grown for farming which in that regard we might as well count ranch animals as not counting as animal life since they aren't "the same" as the animals out in the wild. Plants and fungus are also considered alive, they have been scientifically categorized as living things as well as emoting and responding to the world around them. Mythbusters also confirmed the belief of plant response to music and loud/offensive language toward the plants to further back up scientific study. I'm not the kind of person to tear down another person for their choice in their diet, by all means everyone is free to eat whatever they want as long as it's not eating someone or something while it's still alive. But I don't agree at all for those who bash on others just because they enjoy eating meat and call it murder.
People have a right to enjoy eating what they like to eat, they shouldn't be put down for their diet.

View attachment 4773
This is Jake Shields. He never ate meat in his life, and went on a 15 fight winning streak in the MMA. It took George Saint Pierre to stop this guy. I rest my case.
I don't know whether or not he NEVER ate meat in his entire life but either way there are others who also have as great or even better records in the same or other sports than him throughout time who have ingested meat. It's a feat that's admirable but that is only a small part of his training.

I'd like to point out that those plant studies are bullpl***. Plants don't have a nervous system or brain, so it is impossible for them to think or feel. Their movements might as well function the same as a machine. They react to the world, but they don't feel it.
As for meat, if the raw stuff is so healthy than why do we cook it at all? Is fresh red meat really such a rarity? And who here can claim that hunting down, killing and eating an animal sounds pleasant? Or even easy?
I've hunted and ate an animal I've killed before, you kill them quick so it's an easier and less exhausting battle. This is why we use guns and/or knives. We're not having cock fights to let them get ripped apart until the very end, we shoot them in vulnerable spots to try to have instant kills, it's not guaranteed to have 100% instant kills, true, but still try and if we mess up we try to correct it and kill it. We hunt and eat just like the animals around us, sure we have other options but that doesn't negate the reasoning behind hunting for food. I would hope that just because we have grocery stores around would mean I can't hunt to survive. I enjoy eating deer prepared a special way, I am currently unemployed with no backing so will anyone deny me food? Homeless shelters, unemployment offices, and other services for assistance have denied me services several times before. I'd rather be able to go out and hunt to survive than to starve because everything costs money (except water out of a public fountain).

I wouldn't argue with an entire field of study (botany) and call it BS without reason. Plants react the same way but are programmed differently. Just because they don't have brains or nervous system doesn't mean they can't feel in their own way. They have an entirely different system programmed, they still sense and still react, violently in some species. Throughout history, plants have evolved and there have always been the dangerous kind, they fight amongst their kind, we don't see it but the research is out there for all to read as to how they fight amongst each other, for room, for sun, for water, for survival against other animals and insects.
Speaking of which, we kill bugs and arachnids with no emotion toward it, it's even socially accepted to kill them without second thought, they are considered animals as well and there ARE places in the world where they're considered part of the human diet. We can't ignore that for this argument, what makes insects and arachnids non-animal? Because they're not mammals, birds, reptilian, or amphibian? Pretty convenient.
 

FullmetalHeart20

Well-Known Member
Humans have canines which are carnivorous teeth, we have always been omnivores like bears throughout human history, always have been hunters and gatherers; to denounce our diets throughout history by saying we're designed as herbivores is ignorant and misleading. To argue that living life as a vegetarian doesn't murder then sure, if you don't count plant and fungal life grown for farming which in that regard we might as well count ranch animals as not counting as animal life since they aren't "the same" as the animals out in the wild. Plants and fungus are also considered alive, they have been scientifically categorized as living things as well as emoting and responding to the world around them. Mythbusters also confirmed the belief of plant response to music and loud/offensive language toward the plants to further back up scientific study. I'm not the kind of person to tear down another person for their choice in their diet, by all means everyone is free to eat whatever they want as long as it's not eating someone or something while it's still alive. But I don't agree at all for those who bash on others just because they enjoy eating meat and call it murder.
People have a right to enjoy eating what they like to eat, they shouldn't be put down for their diet.


I don't know whether or not he NEVER ate meat in his entire life but either way there are others who also have as great or even better records in the same or other sports than him throughout time who have ingested meat. It's a feat that's admirable but that is only a small part of his training.


I've hunted and ate an animal I've killed before, you kill them quick so it's an easier and less exhausting battle. This is why we use guns and/or knives. We're not having cock fights to let them get ripped apart until the very end, we shoot them in vulnerable spots to try to have instant kills, it's not guaranteed to have 100% instant kills, true, but still try and if we mess up we try to correct it and kill it. We hunt and eat just like the animals around us, sure we have other options but that doesn't negate the reasoning behind hunting for food. I would hope that just because we have grocery stores around would mean I can't hunt to survive. I enjoy eating deer prepared a special way, I am currently unemployed with no backing so will anyone deny me food? Homeless shelters, unemployment offices, and other services for assistance have denied me services several times before. I'd rather be able to go out and hunt to survive than to starve because everything costs money (except water out of a public fountain).

I wouldn't argue with an entire field of study (botany) and call it BS without reason. Plants react the same way but are programmed differently. Just because they don't have brains or nervous system doesn't mean they can't feel in their own way. They have an entirely different system programmed, they still sense and still react, violently in some species. Throughout history, plants have evolved and there have always been the dangerous kind, they fight amongst their kind, we don't see it but the research is out there for all to read as to how they fight amongst each other, for room, for sun, for water, for survival against other animals and insects.
Speaking of which, we kill bugs and arachnids with no emotion toward it, it's even socially accepted to kill them without second thought, they are considered animals as well and there ARE places in the world where they're considered part of the human diet. We can't ignore that for this argument, what makes insects and arachnids non-animal? Because they're not mammals, birds, reptilian, or amphibian? Pretty convenient.
You're joking, right? Plenty of herbivores have teeth or tusks...something they can fight with. If they didn't, than they'd quickly be hunted to extinction. Our cainines aren't for ripping flesh and tearing arteries. They're for fighting. As for being made as omnivores? What exactly do you know about our physiology? Do you even know our stomach acids PH level?
With Jake Shields, his career is quite an accomplishment. Fighters who have followed his example remarked that they feel stronger in fights. Look it up since you probably don't believe me anyway.
As for your little hunting experience? Yes, you use knives and guns. We don't have claws, or beaks, or proper, neck breaking jaws of teeth. We need to cheat to keep this habit up. And we've been cooking the meat just so we can tolerate it. Why must meat eaters go on about the natural order when our methods are far from natural?
For your plant argument, I don't know what's worse. Taking it a step beyond sensation by saying they might have emotions, or using it to point out the cruelty of veganism. You've basically acknowledged that suffering is not something anyone should cause, even if it was sarcastic. And while a vegetable having feelings or intelligence is doubtful, this is confirmed in regards to animals.
As for hunting to survive, this isn't an apocalypse. If you have the money for the devices and power neccisarry to play Skyrim and use this forum, you can spend it on some quinoa. Or even meat, if you insist on eating it.
As a minor note with bugs, I never really kill them. Squashing and flushing them always seemed like an unnecessary experience when I can just dump them outside.
Sorry if I sound like an ass. Flawed points put me in a bad mood.
 

Benthos

Proud Mer
You're joking, right? Plenty of herbivores have teeth or tusks...something they can fight with. If they didn't, than they'd quickly be hunted to extinction. Our cainines aren't for ripping flesh and tearing arteries. They're for fighting. As for being made as omnivores? What exactly do you know about our physiology? Do you even know our stomach acids PH level?
With Jake Shields, his career is quite an accomplishment. Fighters who have followed his example remarked that they feel stronger in fights. Look it up since you probably don't believe me anyway.
As for your little hunting experience? Yes, you use knives and guns. We don't have claws, or beaks, or proper, neck breaking jaws of teeth. We need to cheat to keep this habit up. And we've been cooking the meat just so we can tolerate it. Why must meat eaters go on about the natural order when our methods are far from natural?
For your plant argument, I don't know what's worse. Taking it a step beyond sensation by saying they might have emotions, or using it to point out the cruelty of veganism. You've basically acknowledged that suffering is not something anyone should cause, even if it was sarcastic. And while a vegetable having feelings or intelligence is doubtful, this is confirmed in regards to animals.
As for hunting to survive, this isn't an apocalypse. If you have the money for the devices and power neccisarry to play Skyrim and use this forum, you can spend it on some quinoa. Or even meat, if you insist on eating it.
As a minor note with bugs, I never really kill them. Squashing and flushing them always seemed like an unnecessary experience when I can just dump them outside.
Sorry if I sound like an ass. Flawed points put me in a bad mood.
They don't have canines for self defense, tusks are meant for self defense and mating competition, not for chomping food. Stomach acids are made for one purpose, to dissolve what's inside the stomach, that doesn't constitute whether or not one is a herbivore. If humans were built as herbivores, we wouldn't have hunted mammoths and other animals in the early days. We would've eaten plants only, there is no herbivore that goes around eating meat. Claws do not constitute a meat eater, the teeth and diets do. What is used in their digestive tract is all a part of it but the teeth plays the biggest role. A Brachiosaurus isn't going to kill and eat a Deinonychus because it's smaller and they just feel they should eat it or want to it, they can't. If they try to, they can't tear at the meat like canines and other carnivorous teeth would. They can and will kill opposition or rivals, but they won't eat them. I haven't seen or heard of a deer eating a smaller animal. Guess what, those canines are meant for chomping and tearing, look it up, biting can be a move yes, animals use it as in self defense, but most animals with jaws that can open and close can bite with different levels of pressure and bite force, you don't need canines to bite someone. They're not developed for biting in self defense, they're useful to enhance the bite but it's the jaw muscle that determines the biting force.

Our tools and our ability to make and use them is not cheap, we as well as primates use tools to help with hunting and other tasks, to say that's cheating because we lack the claws and other natural weapons is stupid since we design it using our brain power. It's because of our brain power and hand-eye coordination which put us and kept us on top of the food chain. Not strength, not our hands though they do play a pivotal part in our development. There are many attributes to cause a fighter to say they feel stronger in fights, it's called nutrients which can be taken in many foods including meat, there's also things that boost morale, fear itself, or to make someone fight for a purpose. That's how humans won wars among themselves as well. The reason why they feel stronger isn't because they stopped eating meat, it's because they see him as idol/role model, they followed his example and they feel stronger because they're following a winner's diet, same is said in other martial arts where they follow Bruce Lee's diet and training which most of Bruce Lee's work is one of the main reasons how MMA got started to begin with. It's whatever works for the personal trainer, if it doesn't work for them it won't, this doesn't mean it's flawed or terrible but just not meant for them. Many MMA fighters even mention how amazing Bruce Lee and he wasn't vegetarian or a vegan. Everything about us and where we are is thanks to everything mentioned about where we came from, you can't just ignore that or say it has no effect or place in this debate. I've had Skyrim for about a year now, I've had this laptop for far longer when I was still in the military, the internet is free due to local hot spots.

Vegetation has a different build and have different systems, they will react differently and yet the same to danger, we're not talking about getting up and moving, we're talking about chemical reactions which even animals have as well. Musk, skunks have fumes, toxin/poisons/bacteria, puking up, etc. Plants have their own reaction as well and some show it as well. Bravo to you dumping them out, but that's just you, many others still squash them and denounce them as living beings as well as plants. These botanists are also reputable folks who shouldn't be ignored because they state something you don't entirely agree with. Plant Physiology, they do have neural chemicals though. Science and Politics behind it. Plants can feel as confirmed by this page among many. More into plants here as well. Because animals show it, it's easier to say they can feel and react but plants can't.

Your flawed points should've put you in a worse mood.
 

FullmetalHeart20

Well-Known Member
A few points.
1. Canines are a type of tooth, nothing more. You can tear an apple apart with them the same as you would a piece of meat. And I don't think you understand how small and blunt ours are compared to actual carnivores, or even some herbivores.
2. Herbivores have a more balanced PH level, while carnivores and omnivores are extremely acidic. One guess whice group we belong in.
3. If our tools really are so important to meat production, I'd like to know how we managed to survive until we had the cognitive ability to make them. A good hint would be the fact that our closest relatives eat roughly a 99% vegan diet.
4. Meat has necessary nutrients that can be found in plants. Pretty much any animal can eat flesh if it had to. Like, say, during an ice age.
5. Good to hear that's how you think performance improves when athletes switch, despite their own claims. Now if only you could prove it.
6. Defending the rights of plants really isn't helping your case on the whole 'eating animals' thing. One of these articles sounds like the entire point of it was a take that to vegans with a chip on their shoulder. Despite the fact that vegetation reacts to the environment, I have never seen proof that it feels. At all.
And as for everything I got wrong in my last post, I apologize.
 

Panthera

Don Gato
I wish I could give you rep for that but somehow I can't ;)
You're totally right.. Even gummy bears contain pig bones. And when you drink milk you should know there's a calf slaughtered to get that milk.. That's why I consider being vegetarian as hypocrit. If you want to save animals you got to be a vegan

I call that recycling... nothing goes to waste. :D

Yeah, I know they mean well and I do think the sentiment behind ethical vegetarianism is very thoughtful, yet I can't stand it when some vegetarians get all "holier than thou" just because they don't eat meat (and I am looking at absolutely no one in this thread, so don't take offense in that statement), 'cause chances are, they probably use other things that were made from animal parts.

On a lighter note, this thread kinda reminded me of this:

Personally I find that way of thinking fanatic and childish when it comes to vegans (No offence to anyone who does have that kind of life-style, that is just my opinion).

Feeling sorry for an animal which is killed for food is absurd! In that case all animals who are carnivorous should starve, considering that we are on top of food chain. Don't get me wrong I love animals... when I was a kid I use to watch a lot of documentaries about animals and I also cried when female leopard caught a gazelle (I was cheering for gazelle to get away).
As I grown I understood that if that leopard doesn't catch some animal, her cubs will starve to death. So it's a necessary kill. I don't see anything wrong to kill an animal for a food. It's absurd to avoid not to eat meat, eggs, drink milk...
 

FullmetalHeart20

Well-Known Member
I call that recycling... nothing goes to waste. :D



Personally I find that way of thinking fanatic and childish when it comes to vegans (No offence to anyone who does have that kind of life-style, that is just my opinion).

Feeling sorry for an animal which is killed for food is absurd! In that case all animals who are carnivorous should starve, considering that we are on top of food chain. Don't get me wrong I love animals... when I was a kid I use to watch a lot of documentaries about animals and I also cried when female leopard caught a gazelle (I was cheering for gazelle to get away).
As I grown I understood that if that leopard doesn't catch some animal, her cubs will starve to death. So it's a necessary kill. I don't see anything wrong to kill an animal for a food. It's absurd to avoid not to eat meat, eggs, drink milk...
Well a carnivore is incapable of surviving without meat, and are incapable of empathizing with prey animals. It's not fair to expect those species to just lay down and die, let alone wipe them out.
As humans, we can understand how horrible dying must be. We can understand that the process will probably carry both physical and emotional pain. We can also provide ourselves with a steady supply of nutritious, satisfying plant foods. So taking this into consideration, what is there in favor of eating meat?
 

nordicowboy

Must be my Nord blood......
View attachment 4773
This is Jake Shields. He never ate meat in his life, and went on a 15 fight winning streak in the MMA. It took George Saint Pierre to stop this guy. I rest my case.
He's also been popped for banned substances. Since going fully vegan he's 1-2-1, and his first fight with Kampmann was a horrid call. Barao, Fedor, Vovchachyn, and T. Fulton are all guys that have over 25 fight win streaks.....none are vegetarians.
 

Doctor Langstrom

I want to be FEARED!
I don't know why us humans are getting blamed. It's the other animals fault. If they didn't taste so damn good, we wouldn't eat them. Also, what other purposes to pigs, chickens, and cattle serve? They are the animals we eat. We don't eat cats, dogs, or horses because on the farm they were the working animals. They helped with the farming.

I have no guilt about eating another animal. In fact, I prefer it. Now, I'm going to enjoy a nice juicy burger at some point today.
 

Panthera

Don Gato
Well a carnivore is incapable of surviving without meat, and are incapable of empathizing with prey animals. It's not fair to expect those species to just lay down and die, let alone wipe them out.
As humans, we can understand how horrible dying must be. We can understand that the process will probably carry both physical and emotional pain. We can also provide ourselves with a steady supply of nutritious, satisfying plant foods. So taking this into consideration, what is there in favor of eating meat?
Yes people can live only on vegetation, but meat is part of our lives for thousands years... What physical and emotional pain are you talking about?
 

Dallas-Arbiter

Well-Known Member
I'm slightly odd, I don't eat pork (it's not a religious thing, I just don't like it). Another reason is there was a cannibal that once said that pork is the closest thing to human flesh. Having said that, if it has swam, flown, or walked the earth I will eat it.
 

Hargood

Defender of Helpless Kittens
I'm slightly odd, I don't eat pork (it's not a religious thing, I just don't like it). Another reason is there was a cannibal that once said that pork is the closest thing to human flesh. Having said that, if it has swam, flown, or walked the earth I will eat it.


I can swim and walk the earth...

...So whatcha doin later there big boy? *wink*wink*
 
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