Welcome to the forums btw.
Imperials or Stormcloaks, what one?
- Thread starter EvilCrazyCows
- Start date
Lunaruse
The Milkdrinking Elf
Dagmar
Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
The number of provinces isn't definitive of anything. The First Imperial Empire or Alessian Empire was never geographically large during its existence. Initially it was only the united territories of Colovia and Nibenay which together comprised Cyrodiil. It expanded to take the Reach which at the time consisted of what is now eastern High Rock and Western Skyrim but it never grew much beyond that. The Empire has also been historically resilient, with each successive Empire exceeding the reach of the prior one. The Second Empire consisted of all of Tamriel except Morrowind at the height of its power and the Third Empire consisted of all of Tamriel.
For all the chest puffing by the Aldmeri Dominion role players that come to this thread, the Dominion has failed in all of three of its incarnations to even come remotely close to the dominance of the second and third incarnations of the Imperial Empire. As the saying goes, better to have been a has been than a never was.
The Stormcloaks =/= all Nords or even a majority of the Nords of Skyrim. The Empire cares enough not to abandon the huge contingent of Nords that remain loyal to the Empire and want to keep Skyrim within the Empire. It's fulfilling its duty towards its citizens in Skyrim.
DrunkenMage
Intoxicated Arch-Mage
Considering the Aldmeri Dominion suffered a major defeat against a weakened, unprepared Empire. I would like to know why they believe they will do better against a pissed off, prepared Empire.
NENALATA
Last King of the Ayleids - RETIRED
It is when you consider that nearly every lost Province was due to either the Empire abandoning them (which resulted in Provinces like Morrowind refusing to have anything to do with the Empire), or Provinces that were liberated by the Thalmor (such as Valenwood) and the Empire simply 'let them go' without a fight.
I doubt that. Four holds may not be a clear majority, however, they're also not a minority. Furthermore, if you claim that putting people in cages and summary executions minus a trial is a form of compassion, then that's all the more reason to justify 'regime' change.
Because by your Emperor signing the WGC, we effectively won the war. Hammerfell is in ruins and is no longer part of your Empire. Skyrim is resisting you and will continue to do so. The battle you won in Cyrodil, cost you. It costs us nothing to try again on our terms, at a time of our choosing.
Mr.Self Destruct
Chosen Undead
It took the Dominion nearly a hundred years of planning to be defeated militarily by a weakened Empire.
It took Tiber Septim about 45 minutes to take Alinor.
Just let that sink in for a moment.
DrunkenMage
Intoxicated Arch-Mage
We also like to hang Thalmor Lords off towers.
Edit: Bloody forums posted me twice.
Dagmar
Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
It really isn't. The point still stands that geographical size isn't indicative of the viability of the Empire. The Thalmor didn't liberate Valenwood. They backed a coup and then proceeded to purge anyone that didn't support the new regime. The very notion that an oppressive totalitariian form of government liberates anyone is laughably absurd.
It's not a majority. It changes nothing about the fact that characterizing the Stormcloaks imposing their will over roughly half of the population of a province who don't want any such thing and prefer to remain part of an Empire to which they've belonged for over six centuries as simply letting Skyrim go is grossly inaccurate and misleading.
First of all this is a total straw man. I never characterized any such act as a form of compassion so it's full of fail at inception. Second, replacing one regime with another that's just as oppressive is hardly a persuasive argument. The Stormcloaks generally don't even take prisoners and their leader not only believes in mass summary executions without trial but he categorizes actions that aren't even deemed criminal by the Empire or any other civilized nation state as capital crimes.
Hammerfell is not in ruins. That was over 20 years ago and the theater of war was restricted to southern Hammerfell for the majority of both wars.
Last time I checked you didn't own the copyright to the Elder Scrolls games. The Stormcloaks =/= Skyrim.
Soldiers and the resources to wage war aren't produced out of thin air. Trivializing the losses in resources and manpower that the Aldmeri Dominion suffered from the Great War and the war in Hammerfell afterwards is nothing more than an exercise in propaganda that doesn't reflect the reality of the situation. Trivializing the resources and manpower to mount another offensive is no different.
NENALATA
Last King of the Ayleids - RETIRED
@Mr. Slef Destruct
First of all, your fledgling Empire never 'defeated' the Dominion, you surrendered and the Summerset Isles were unscathed by the war. Secondly, by signing the White Gold Concordant the Empire was spared and it exists today because we allow it to exist. Thirdly, both Numidiums (a purely Elven creation) were eventually destroyed. Finally, judging by the number of Provinces your Empire has lost because of us (due to our planning) and the submission of your Emperor/Empire to the Thalmor, I would say the years of planning have paid off. It is time for man to learn his place again and it is time for the Elves to reclaim what is rightfully ours.
Now you let that sink in for a moment.
![It took the Dominion nearly a hundred years of planning to be defeated militarily by a weakened Empire. It took Tiber Septim about 45 minutes to take Alinor. Just let that sink in for a moment. [IMG]](http://skyrimforum.com/ It took the Dominion nearly a hundred years of planning to be defeated militarily by a weakened Empire. It took Tiber Septim about 45 minutes to take Alinor. Just let that sink in for a moment. [IMG])
First of all, your fledgling Empire never 'defeated' the Dominion, you surrendered and the Summerset Isles were unscathed by the war. Secondly, by signing the White Gold Concordant the Empire was spared and it exists today because we allow it to exist. Thirdly, both Numidiums (a purely Elven creation) were eventually destroyed. Finally, judging by the number of Provinces your Empire has lost because of us (due to our planning) and the submission of your Emperor/Empire to the Thalmor, I would say the years of planning have paid off. It is time for man to learn his place again and it is time for the Elves to reclaim what is rightfully ours.
Now you let that sink in for a moment.
NENALATA
Last King of the Ayleids - RETIRED
Dagmar
Honestly, I'm not surprised that the 'lesser races' are ignorant to the Thalmor and our mission. We only wish to improve quality of life and to save Tamriel from the darkness that is man, in essence, to save man from himself. All throughout man's history he has created chaos and drenched the continent in blood, dragging both himself, his neighbors and us down with him. The Thalmor exist to bring order to the nations of man, putting an end to the chaos he has caused in Tamriel! In short: To put things back to right. Even if that means a Second Great War.
And I'm pleased to see how Emperor Titus Mede II and the citizens of the Empire have acknowledged Elven Supremacy by throwing off worship of false Gods and embracing the will of the Thalmor.
We are the rightful rulers of Tamriel.
While man was in caves littered with the filth of his own excrement, hiding from his own irrational fears, the Elves lived in White-Gold cities exploring Tamriel and learning the very deepest secrets of the arcane. The modern day pantheon of Gods was handed down from us, much of Tamriel's culture and to some extent language, was passed down from us as well. And last but not least, we certainly wrote the book on magic, although we did not create it ourselves.
And you can have whatever opinion you like, however Elven Supremacy is the only truth.
Honestly, I'm not surprised that the 'lesser races' are ignorant to the Thalmor and our mission. We only wish to improve quality of life and to save Tamriel from the darkness that is man, in essence, to save man from himself. All throughout man's history he has created chaos and drenched the continent in blood, dragging both himself, his neighbors and us down with him. The Thalmor exist to bring order to the nations of man, putting an end to the chaos he has caused in Tamriel! In short: To put things back to right. Even if that means a Second Great War.
And I'm pleased to see how Emperor Titus Mede II and the citizens of the Empire have acknowledged Elven Supremacy by throwing off worship of false Gods and embracing the will of the Thalmor.
We are the rightful rulers of Tamriel.
While man was in caves littered with the filth of his own excrement, hiding from his own irrational fears, the Elves lived in White-Gold cities exploring Tamriel and learning the very deepest secrets of the arcane. The modern day pantheon of Gods was handed down from us, much of Tamriel's culture and to some extent language, was passed down from us as well. And last but not least, we certainly wrote the book on magic, although we did not create it ourselves.
And you can have whatever opinion you like, however Elven Supremacy is the only truth.
NENALATA
Last King of the Ayleids - RETIRED
Jader
The Mystic Marksman
And yet the Thalmor can't manage to kill an aging woman and a crazy old man.what does that say about the Thalmor? Doubt the Thalmor could handle trying to get me.Slit the throats of any of em who near me
Dagmar
Defender of the Bunnies of Skyrim
The Third Empire conquered the Aldmeri Dominion with Numidium. The Second Empire conquered Alinor with conventional warfare. The Aldmeri Dominion has never defeated the Empire. The First and Second Imperial Empires collapsed from internal disputes. These are matters of undeniable fact.
The Aldmeri Dominion blew its load in its bid to conquer the Empire. It was so weak by the end of the Great War that it couldn't even hold on to the land that the Empire ceded to it under the White Gold Concordat. It's delusionally optimistic to think that "Old Mary" had anything left to throw at the Empire but harassment attacks reminiscent of its actions in the Second Era. The people were simply sick of war and wanted and needed the opportunity to rebuild without having to deal with open hostilities with the Aldmeri Dominion at the same time. Regardless of whether it was the right decision for the Emperor and the Elder Council to make at the time it was a popularly supported one.
So what? Neither "Numidium" was an Altmer creation. The true Numidium was a Dwemer creation and Akulahkhan was a Chimer creation. The Empire controlled Numidium because Morrowind was part of the Empire underscoring that the concept of Merish solidarity is a myth of your personal headcanon. Their destruction had nothing to do with the Aldmeri Dominion and does nothing to change the fact that the Aldmeri Dominion has fallen to the Empire in every past incarnation and the Empire has never fallen to Aldmeri Dominion.
The only thing I'm ignorant about is your personal headcanon which holds no interest for me. My interest is in the real lore and canon of the Elder Scrolls universe. The only headcanon that interests me is Michael Kirkbride's and his headcanon of what the Thalmor are about is nothing like yours.
