I see a lot of twisting my argument around, fair enough. Two can play.
The effect of being Totalitarian Asshats and getting their nose in places they shouldn't, of course.
Show me the examples of the Empire being Totalitarian. Where they seek to control all aspects of private and public life. Oh, right you can't because the Totalitarian argument stems from politicians trying to put Communists and Facists into one group.
I'm sure they do appear that way to you. Imperialism has that effect on people.
Actually, mainly because they were largely against the Nine Divines and found Imperials to be uptight pricks because all they did was work and visit the chapel of Talos.
Disciplined soldiers aren't militia, they're trained to fight (which was what he had).
So the Stormcloaks aren't disciplined? They don't get any form of training? Tullius is using Militia, so why is it only an excuse for Ulfric?
Think of it as the former High King against Ulfric Stormcloak. Ulfric WRECKED him, I doubt a clone would have faired much better even if they both fought him at the same time. If there was an uprising, they'd have little to no training and wouldn't hold their ground for very long. I'm not impressed.
Yes, he wrecked the boy King. Too cowardly to face Istlod, aye?
Simply because Tiber Septim was cruel and unusual doesn't mean he was a bad warrior. It just meant he knew how to get places, and it wasn't by being nice. Imagine if all the famed Warriors in history were nice people, Genghis Khan and Attila the Hun wouldn't be known for pl*** if they weren't horribly cruel.
Just because Ulfric is a good warrior, doesn't mean he's a good King. Tiber Septim was an effective ruler, Titus also.
What has Ulfric done besides the Civil War? His city requires segregation, mark of a good ruler?
And Ulfric's capture was a fluke.
I'm sure, getting captured and outsmarted must always be a fluke. Maybe the Aldmeri Dominion nearly destroying the Empire was a fluke too.
He probably didn't expect Tullius to actually know what he was doing, and ambushes are a pain to deal with anyways because you don't see them coming. Thats why its an ambush. They're also really easy to do, and even if you had crap guys you could still win a battle (for example, Spain's commonfolk fighting France's unstoppable military during the Peninsular War).
He didn't expect a Military General to know what he was doing? Or didn't expect Tullius to know what Ulfric was doing?
Ambushes aren't easy to do when the Thalmor are alerting the Stormcloaks to it, and they slip away. Setting up an ambush requires knowledge of enemy movements, and when you're capturing the enemy leader? Is that really easy to do?
Tullius didn't have just rabble with arms, he had soldiers. In Ulfric's position, I'd surrender too to try to save their lives. Turns out, the Empire doesn't know mercy well enough to care.
Tullius is using locals, Rikke calls them Militia. So when Tullius uses militia they're soldiers, but when Ulfric uses them it is a rabble. Are you telling me Ulfric is that plops? He'd have knowledge of legionary tactics, fighting style and ability. His has ex Legionaries also, shouldn't he have the upper hand?
So when he created the Stormcloaks
years ago. Did they all just sit around wanking instead of training? Yeah, I can see them smashing the Aldmeri Dominion when they decide to invade.
They knew they were going to die. The punishment for treason is death.
Chalk that up for a lesson learned for Ulfric. After all, even Caesar lost a battle but was still praised as a genius strategist. Ulfric has a slip up and he's banned for life?
Doesn't that seem a bit biased?
Of course it is biased. The Empire surrenders for the first time in two Eras. It is weak, cowardly and should be destroyed. Ulfric Stormcloak surrenders without barely a fight to General Tullius, god damn hero trying to save lives. (Even though they would be killed, either in Skyrim or Cyrodiil)
Being captured by the enemy was pretty common back in the day, but if you're including one of those captures to Markarth, then you shouldn't and here's why. He was arrested for Talos worship, not during a battle. If it were a battle, then I could see your stance but it wasn't. Infact, the battle beforehand when he captured Markarth is a pretty interesting achievement seeing as sieges are a lot harder to pull off than battles on the field.
I don't like Ulfric either, but your total disdain for the guy is making you overlook EVERYTHING. Come on, Mage, you're better than this.
Alright, he was captured twice. By his enemies.
Yes it was a good achievement, Nordic militia filled with ex legion soldiers vs Reachmen with no military training, zero tactics and being sent flying by the Thu'um. Yeah, I can see it was a close match indeed.
So Galmar's Brother is the Jarl of Windhelm now? Or is it the people who make the laws and policies, not the Jarls? That's such a shame, seeing the Jarls not have any control over their cities.
No. But Ulfric and his soldiers don't seem to care about him threatening them in the streets. They must not have any control, because apparently Nords can't be forced to do things according to another Stormcloak supporter in this thread.
What makes you think that Ulfric and company suspects the Dunmer of being Spies? What makes you think he would issue the order for arresting some Dunmer in the night just to torture them to see what they fess up? One of them has Legion Armor in their building, so maybe there is a reason to think so but Ulfric hasn't issued any arrests that we're aware about yet.
It is an ex-Stormcloak who calls them spies. Doesn't need to be Ulfric personally, it is within his city and those men believe themselves Stormcloaks. He doesn't care what happens to the Dunmer, his disdain for them is clear.
Stormcloaks are not so bright, wearing Imperial armor makes them call you a spy. Guess the EETC Mercenaries are our secret agents.
No, rather it was Galmar's brother who has no pull with the Jarl of Windhelm. Don't grasp for straws.
Forgive me, I didn't mean to grasp. How mistaken I was to believe that the brother of Ulfric's best friend, housecarl and brother in arms... Would have any sort of pull with Jarl Ulfric.
That's most of what I said, good to see you're listening. But if Titus Mede dies (of course by assassination), his son would take the throne. Considering how long it has been since an Emperor has been assassination, I wonder when it will happen again. Perhaps a Thalmor agent, this time, right before the next war.
The next war would most likely start after Mede's death.
If Ulfric dies, whatever to the rest of the world, another Warlord down. If Tullius dies, whatever to the rest of the world, another soldier fell. If the Emperor dies as he did... then that's not just a murder, that's a sign. He died, on a boat, full of his precious PO guys. The Emperor is not safe and may never be safe for quite some time.
And the heir of Tiber Septim died, praying in the temple. Surrounded by Blades, surrounded by an entire city of soldiers. Being Emperor is rarely safe.
Perhaps The Jarl is up in age, so its possible he met him after the great war and before Markarth and as a child. Ulfric is a Jarl's son, afterall. Considering both are port cities, I doubt they'd ignore each other for long. There is a whole world of possibilities, so whose to say?
How is Falkreath a port city? Do you require a map? Stormcloak logic at it's finest.
Alright. How many Emperors can you name? How many Jarls of Falkreath?
How many Grand Marshall's of the Imperial Legion can you name? How many Jarls of Solitude can you directly name? How many High Kings in the Third and Fourth Era could you name?
Just because we're not informed, doesn't mean they're peasants unworthy of any thought.
Skyrim may be the second most important (with Hammerfell being dead last), but the first takes priorities. A lot of folks don't like playing second fiddle, its about time the Nords of Skyrim got tired of it too.
Stormcloaks =/= Nords of Skyrim. There are Nords standing against Ulfric Stormcloak.
Oh, so you're saying that some of the holds (excluding the holds bordering Windhelm) may not support Elisif? Sounds like an easy win for Ulfric, can't have that. Better move in and remind the other Jarls who think a third party is an option that the Empire is here and always watching.
Not at all. It has nothing to do with supporting Elisif, she isn't promised to be High Queen. Ulfric isn't allowing the Moot to meet until he controls all of Skyrim, so yeah easy win for Ulfric.
So Ulfric refusing to allow the Moot to meet, is that showing his true political weakness? He can't take a chance? He can't risk to lose becoming High King?
If the Empire didn't join in Balgruuf may or may not have fought against Ulfric. He would have been a third party. Whose to say how that would of gone.
His Court are opposed to the Stormcloaks. His citizens also believe he'll go Imperial.
"I don't think he likes either Ulfric or Elisif much. Who can blame him? But I've no doubt he'll prove loyal to the Empire in the end. He's no traitor." - Alvor
"He's been trying to stay out of the war, but it can't last. He's going to have to pick a side. I'm afraid he's going to make the wrong choice." - Gerdur
Right, wouldn't want another Titus Mede to step up, would we?
Learn why Titus Mede stepped up. Then comment. Torygg isn't anything like Emperor Thules the Gibbering.
So, this isn't a fight for Skyrim, this is a play to show the Empire is still here? The Imperials aren't trying to defend Skyrim, they're trying to defend their power. What a weak claim to the moral highground.
No. I won't even bother with this one.
This war with the Aldmeri, its like the Dragons in Game of Thrones. Always promised it'll come but it sure is taking its time. If the Aldmeri REALLY wanted a war, why not just invade during the climax of the Skyrim Civil War? Or after the Emperor has been assassinated? They're not looking for a war, they already won and the Empire has accepted all their laws.
The Aldmeri are not looking for war? Of all the things posted in this thread, that ranks up next to that Stormcloak supporter who was here ages ago and said the Imperials were hiding lore.
Show me where the Aldmeri aren't looking for a war?
"It is more like the calm between storms. And the next storm, I think, will be far deadlier than the last." - Ondolemar
Background: Ulfric first came to our attention during the First War Against the Empire, when he was taken as a prisoner of war during the campaign for the White-Gold Tower. - Thalmor Dossier: Ulfric Stormcloak
"There's no worse enemy to humankind in Tamriel. The Empire barely survived the last war. The Thalmor don't intend to lose the next one." - Delphine
There can be no doubt that the current peace cannot last forever. The Thalmor take the long view, as is proved by the sequence of events leading up to the Great War. All those who value freedom over tyranny can only hope that before it is too late, Hammerfell and the Empire will be reconciled and stand united against the Thalmor threat. Otherwise, any hope to stem the tide of Thalmor rule over all of Tamriel is dimmed. - The Great War (Book)
What would the Thalmor possibly want? Land? Even MORE power? No, I think they're good. Any second war sounds like a War of Imperial Aggression, which would seem to be an ongoing theme since their intervention in Skyrim.
The Thalmor want to create a new Merethic Era. Where elves had ruled Tamriel.
Sworn enemies of the Empire and everything it stands for.
The Thalmor are good, they're not going to do anything. They're happy and fine. Heard it from Ozan himself, which destroys every single Stormcloak support in this thread. Thalmor are peaceful and will only attack from Imperial Aggression.
... Lol. Yeah, Ulfric kills High King Torygg declares war against the Western Holds, seeks to kick out the Empire. Legion steps in to end the rebellion, obvious Imperial aggression.
You even said yourself, talking of the Nords in the Legion whose families live on their wages.
What of it? There isn't a welfare system in Tamriel. Some people become soldiers to earn money for their family.
If the Empire were truly so grand, the Nords wouldn't have to leave their families in poverty.
What are you even on about? You're talking out of your ass now. If the Stormcloaks are so good, why is their poverty under their rule too? Should they be fl*ffing Communists, because everyone should be equal earning the same, living the same?
If the Nords are so warlike, then why is it that it is only Cyrodiil who requires fighting?
Name me the number of wars fought by Cyrodiil, then name me the number fought by Skyrim and the Nords.
Without the Empire, Thalmor wouldn't be in Skyrim. Skyrim shares no borders with the Aldmeri, only Cyrodiil does.
The Nords have no reason to be afraid, yet the Empire claims they do. Now that the Nords fight, so too do the Imperials if only to back their lies.
"What I fear, is that the Thalmor will see our victory here and turn greater attention to our shores." - Ulfric Stormcloak
Guess Ulfric and the Stormcloaks are no better than them lying Imperials.