Storm cloaks are hypocrites

Raijin said:

Daelon DuLac said:

Raijin said:

What's pointless is not taking an advantage of a gift that was given to you. What's pointless is buying a game, and purposely not going through the available quests (especially the main ones) that was given to you by the hard working staffs at Bethesda.

Let me ask you a question and don't take it the wrong way.... How can you enjoy Skyrim when you rarely do the mainquest? Your best bet is to stick with Oblivion or morrowind where you are not the dragonborn.

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There are just so many other great things to do in Skyrim besides the Civil War and the Dragon Quests. As many times as I've played it just gets boring and there is very little point to each one. They don't seem to make a difference. Nobody cares and you're rarely, if every acknowledged. At least with some of the Thane quests, Solstheim or Dawnguard, in the long run there's a result that matters. With both the Civil War and Alduin, you seem to be the only one that knows or cares that anything even happened.

Don't get me wrong. I still do the questlines (okay, I usually skip the Civil War or just go Imperial and get it over with), they're just not as enjoyable as others and there are so few RP opportunities in them that they just don't have as much joy as the others.

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But you cut yourself short on so many quests. Theirs so many quests that you can do. Their not unlimited. If the game gets boring then it's time to uninstall skyrim and take a break from it for a while, and get yourself another game to play with.

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It's certainly not boring, I just get bored with the Alduin based quests and the Civil War quests, mainly because I just don't care and they're so linear. The best part of the Alduin quests is the search for the Dragon Scroll for me, but I don't need to be doing that questline to do that. As to the Blades it's just fetch and quest, fetch and qeust. I'll stick with DB or TG if I want that. When it comes to the Civil War there really aren't any good quests as far as I'm concerned. Since I'm not a person that likes followers or works in teams, all those battle scenes just bore the spit out of me and frankly, I don't care who wins. 99% of the time I just do the Imperial side so I can keep Balgruff, Sidgear and make Elisif happy and get Maven in Riften.

Raijin said:

Jeremius said:

Raijin said:

What's pointless is not taking an advantage of a gift that was given to you. What's pointless is buying a game, and purposely not going through the available quests (especially the main ones) that was given to you by the hard working staffs at Bethesda.

Let me ask you a question and don't take it the wrong way.... How can you enjoy Skyrim when you rarely do the mainquest? Your best bet is to stick with Oblivion or morrowind where you are not the dragonborn.

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Let me answer your question with a question: How can you enjoy Skyrim doing the same thing for the same reason all the time? Some people like being different, so Why can't I not do the main questline and RP that my character has no idea what a DragonBorn is or their role in the world of Tamriel?

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If I don't feel like playing a Dragonborn character I simply play another game like Dragon Age or The witcher. Besides you don't have to play the same thing. You can either be a warrior or a mage... or an assassin... with having the power of a Dragonborn.

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Play the main quest again. No matter what class you play, it is the same. Stop Alduin because it is your destiny to do so. Learn shouts because you can by being Dragonborn. Hunt Dragons because you are Dragonborn. Very Boring.

Jeremius said:

Raijin said:

Jeremius said:

Let me answer your question with a question: How can you enjoy Skyrim doing the same thing for the same reason all the time? Some people like being different, so Why can't I not do the main questline and RP that my character has no idea what a DragonBorn is or their role in the world of Tamriel?

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If I don't feel like playing a Dragonborn character I simply play another game like Dragon Age or The witcher. Besides you don't have to play the same thing. You can either be a warrior or a mage... or an assassin... with having the power of a Dragonborn.

Click to expand...

Play the main quest again. No matter what class you play, it is the same. Stop Alduin because it is your destiny to do so. Learn shouts because you can by being Dragonborn. Hunt Dragons because you are Dragonborn. Very Boring.

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What about repeating the other guild quests like the thieves guild or the dark brotherhood? Are you just going to stop doing all of the quests that's given to you all together? If it's that boring then it's time to play another game.

When things get boring it's an indication that it's time to move on and play other games. That's just me.

Daelon DuLac said:

It's certainly not boring, I just get bored with the Alduin based quests and the Civil War quests, mainly because I just don't care and they're so linear. The best part of the Alduin quests is the search for the Dragon Scroll for me, but I don't need to be doing that questline to do that. As to the Blades it's just fetch and quest, fetch and qeust. I'll stick with DB or TG if I want that. When it comes to the Civil War there really aren't any good quests as far as I'm concerned. Since I'm not a person that likes followers or works in teams, all those battle scenes just bore the spit out of me and frankly, I don't care who wins. 99% of the time I just do the Imperial side so I can keep Balgruff, Sidgear and make Elisif happy and get Maven in Riften.

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Whats the difference between Alduins quest and the quest of the DB and TG? Aren't they the same too?

Raijin said:

Daelon DuLac said:

It's certainly not boring, I just get bored with the Alduin based quests and the Civil War quests, mainly because I just don't care and they're so linear. The best part of the Alduin quests is the search for the Dragon Scroll for me, but I don't need to be doing that questline to do that. As to the Blades it's just fetch and quest, fetch and qeust. I'll stick with DB or TG if I want that. When it comes to the Civil War there really aren't any good quests as far as I'm concerned. Since I'm not a person that likes followers or works in teams, all those battle scenes just bore the spit out of me and frankly, I don't care who wins. 99% of the time I just do the Imperial side so I can keep Balgruff, Sidgear and make Elisif happy and get Maven in Riften.

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Whats the difference between Alduins quest and the quest of the DB and TG? Aren't they the same too?

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I always refer to the Main Questline as Alduin's quest since the DLC is already called Dragonborn and doesn't really have anything to do with the Main questline. The DB (Dark Brotherhood) and TG (Thieve's Guild) don't have anything to do with the main questline to me. Totally separate questlines that you really don't need the main one to complete.

Raijin said:

Jeremius said:

Raijin said:

If I don't feel like playing a Dragonborn character I simply play another game like Dragon Age or The witcher. Besides you don't have to play the same thing. You can either be a warrior or a mage... or an assassin... with having the power of a Dragonborn.

Click to expand...

Play the main quest again. No matter what class you play, it is the same. Stop Alduin because it is your destiny to do so. Learn shouts because you can by being Dragonborn. Hunt Dragons because you are Dragonborn. Very Boring.

Click to expand...

What about repeating the other guild quests like the thieves guild or the dark brotherhood? Are you just going to stop doing all of the quests that's given to you all together? If it's that boring then it's time to play another game.

When things get boring it's an indication that it's time to move on and play other games. That's just me.

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I can come up with reasons for my characters joining the factions. I cannot come up with a reason for my character being Dragonborn except what is given in-game.

The Stormcloaks being hypocrites is a fabrication of the Imperials looking for support because they have no evidence to prove anything.

Jeremius said:

The Stormcloaks being hypocrites is a fabrication of the Imperials looking for support because they have no evidence to prove anything.

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??? And the Imperials lookin gfor support because they have no evidence to prove anything is slanderous propoganda put out by ignorant savages with God complexes. Oh wait... that's me!

Daelon DuLac said:

]??? And the Imperials lookin gfor support because they have no evidence to prove anything is slanderous propoganda put out by ignorant savages with God complexes. Oh wait... that's me!

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Damn faithless Imperials...

DrunkenMage said:

Daelon DuLac said:

]??? And the Imperials lookin gfor support because they have no evidence to prove anything is slanderous propoganda put out by ignorant savages with God complexes. Oh wait... that's me!

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Damn faithless Imperials...

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Faithless! Faithless! Oh wait... what were we talking about again?

Personally I don't like the Stormcloaks, they're very intolerant (Galmar is a thug who is itching to kill Baalgruf, Ulfric is more reasonable) and I don't think the murder of Toryyg was justified, though the Markarth Incident wasn't fair either.

Now, I'm not insanely thrilled with the Empire either, as the very word "Empire" has negative connotations, but they seem more reasonable and fair, overall. Many Nords support being in the Empire as well. (My current character is a Nord)
I would prefer to pick no sides frankly, if this were all real, but then I'm not playing the full game and getting my money's worth if I don't.

So this play through, after I whack Alduin, I'll join the Imperials.
However, at some point in another play through, I'll join the Stormcloaks just to see those quests.

Pálrún said:

Personally I don't like the Stormcloaks, they're very intolerant (Galmar is a thug who is itching to kill Baalgruf, Ulfric is more reasonable) and I don't think the murder of Toryyg was justified, though the Markarth Incident wasn't fair either.

Now, I'm not insanely thrilled with the Empire either, as the very word "Empire" has negative connotations, but they seem more reasonable and fair, overall. Many Nords support being in the Empire as well. (My current character is a Nord)
I would prefer to pick no sides frankly, if this were all real, but then I'm not playing the full game and getting my money's worth if I don't.

So this play through, after I whack Alduin, I'll join the Imperials.
However, at some point in another play through, I'll join the Stormcloaks just to see those quests.

Click to expand...

Just ignore the Civil War thing then. I do most of the time. It's not like it's a very important or even have extensive questline. The way I look at it is that Skryim is so huge and there's so much going on, why would I care if 2 political factions have issues with each other. It makes no appreciable differance in my character's life. Besides, soldiers don't make any money. That's why I came to Skyrim - for money & power. I'm way too old to be idealistic, especially on a fool's errand.

I'll just leave this here:

Daelon DuLac said:

Pálrún said:

Personally I don't like the Stormcloaks, they're very intolerant (Galmar is a thug who is itching to kill Baalgruf, Ulfric is more reasonable) and I don't think the murder of Toryyg was justified, though the Markarth Incident wasn't fair either.

Now, I'm not insanely thrilled with the Empire either, as the very word "Empire" has negative connotations, but they seem more reasonable and fair, overall. Many Nords support being in the Empire as well. (My current character is a Nord)
I would prefer to pick no sides frankly, if this were all real, but then I'm not playing the full game and getting my money's worth if I don't.

So this play through, after I whack Alduin, I'll join the Imperials.
However, at some point in another play through, I'll join the Stormcloaks just to see those quests.

Click to expand...

Just ignore the Civil War thing then. I do most of the time. It's not like it's a very important or even have extensive questline. The way I look at it is that Skryim is so huge and there's so much going on, why would I care if 2 political factions have issues with each other. It makes no appreciable differance in my character's life. Besides, soldiers don't make any money. That's why I came to Skyrim - for money & power. I'm way too old to be idealistic, especially on a fool's errand.

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Well, like I said, I want to see everything in the game, eventually.
I'm also looking forward to the next play-through, I'm going to buy and install all the DLCs for that. I know I could run a 2nd and 3rd playthrough simultaneously with the first, but I want to start the game fresh when I add the DLCs (Dragonborn, Dawnbreaker, and even Hearthfire), so I'd rather pretty much wrap up the 1st playthrough, in case it adds weirdness or glitches.
I'm already better than halfway through the game, so.. oh, and then there's the world of mods to look forward to.

The thing I keep wondering about.. I'm deliberately stalling on the main quest, (I'm on The Fallen) so, for now, the truce I brokered is indefinite I guess.. or does the game count so many days or weeks and then say, okay, time's up, ready or not let the war continue?

Pálrún said:

Daelon DuLac said:

Pálrún said:

Personally I don't like the Stormcloaks, they're very intolerant (Galmar is a thug who is itching to kill Baalgruf, Ulfric is more reasonable) and I don't think the murder of Toryyg was justified, though the Markarth Incident wasn't fair either.

Now, I'm not insanely thrilled with the Empire either, as the very word "Empire" has negative connotations, but they seem more reasonable and fair, overall. Many Nords support being in the Empire as well. (My current character is a Nord)
I would prefer to pick no sides frankly, if this were all real, but then I'm not playing the full game and getting my money's worth if I don't.

So this play through, after I whack Alduin, I'll join the Imperials.
However, at some point in another play through, I'll join the Stormcloaks just to see those quests.

Click to expand...

Just ignore the Civil War thing then. I do most of the time. It's not like it's a very important or even have extensive questline. The way I look at it is that Skryim is so huge and there's so much going on, why would I care if 2 political factions have issues with each other. It makes no appreciable differance in my character's life. Besides, soldiers don't make any money. That's why I came to Skyrim - for money & power. I'm way too old to be idealistic, especially on a fool's errand.

Click to expand...

Well, like I said, I want to see everything in the game, eventually.
I'm also looking forward to the next play-through, I'm going to buy and install all the DLCs for that. I know I could run a 2nd and 3rd playthrough simultaneously with the first, but I want to start the game fresh when I add the DLCs (Dragonborn, Dawnbreaker, and even Hearthfire), so I'd rather pretty much wrap up the 1st playthrough, in case it adds weirdness or glitches.
I'm already better than halfway through the game, so.. oh, and then there's the world of mods to look forward to.

The thing I keep wondering about.. I'm deliberately stalling on the main quest, (I'm on The Fallen) so, for now, the truce I brokered is indefinite I guess.. or does the game count so many days or weeks and then say, okay, time's up, ready or not let the war continue?

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Don't know. I have never brokered the truce. If I did the mainline, I always just did it through. As I said, I rarely, if ever do the Civil War questline unless I run right through it to get the Jarls I like.

Anouck said:

He is a God. That is established throughout the game and you can read it for yourself on several lore websites.

The shrine dedicated to him has an effect on you when activating it. If he wouldn't be a God, that shrine would be useless. The same thing goes for the Talos amulets, which reduces the time between shouts with 20%. All of that wouldn't work without Talos being an actual divine.

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I'd say he's on the same level as the tribunal, not the eight. I'm guessing that topic would derail this thread though

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ciphoenix said:

Anouck said:

He is a God. That is established throughout the game and you can read it for yourself on several lore websites.

The shrine dedicated to him has an effect on you when activating it. If he wouldn't be a God, that shrine would be useless. The same thing goes for the Talos amulets, which reduces the time between shouts with 20%. All of that wouldn't work without Talos being an actual divine.

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I'd say he's on the same level as the tribunal, not the eight. I'm guessing that topic would derail this thread though

Sent from my SM-N900 using Tapatalk

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@Anouck - so you say, but I am a firm believer that no man can become a god. Even in our society we have tales of that going on in a number of religions. Look at the "heroes" of Ancient Greece.

Oh, wait, the "heroes" of Ancient Greece had the blood of a God in them which allowed them to be raised to Godhood.

I can apply that here! Talos was Tiber Septim, who was a Dragonborn, right? A Dragonborn has the blood of a dragon, right? A dragon is equivalent to Aedra and Daedra, right? Therefore, the raising of Tiber Septim to Godhood is possible!

Good gravy! I just poked a huge hole in my own argument and argued the opposite!

Thanks Anouck! You made me think! I do it so rarely, I even surprised myself.

Daelon DuLac said:

but I am a firm believer that no man can become a god.

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Talos (Divine) isn't a man, but three beings that make up the one entity.

Wulfharth, Tiber Septim, and Zurin Arctus = Talos the God

I remember reading that the Forsworn were the original inhabitants of Skyrim, and then were dominated by the Nord culture. I don't wanna bother looking for it in the lore, but I'm sure it's somewhere. If that's the case, then in general terms Storm Cloaks may be hypocritical, because as a race they persecuted a people as well. In that same context, Imperials would just be continuing on with behaviors already displayed by the Nord culture, in dealings with the Forsworn.

My take on the civil war, which seems to come up in topic a bunch during this convo (naturally), is that I don't need to play it to have a good experience with Skyrim. I can RP a character who has no interest in politics. I happen to play one that does, and she hates the Thalmor. By proxy, she's no fan of the Imperials. At the same time, she considers the Storm Cloaks a rag tag band of separatists, who are split on their support for Ulfric (some of them question his mind, and his intentions). She is from High Rock, so cares little about the political standing in this area. I keep up to date on the battles (looking at maps), and I use both sides to sell my stuff too. That's about as far as it goes.

As for avoiding the main questline (with alduin), aren't you forced to do it at several points, as the main line intersects with other quest lines? The mages guild comes to mind...

Well the focus of the thread went to the toilet after 5 pages, on topic I hate both the heretical stormcloaks and the warlike imperials. Glory to the Dominion