Is Sword and Shield Weak?

[VFN]

I made a sword and shield character and leveled to about 7 with 2 perks in one hand,2 in block (using the unpatched version so my block is maxed by taking deflect arrows) 1 in heavy armor. I made a complete set of steel armor and was using a 9 or 10 damage sword that took 5 points of health and stamina with frost that I got from the dragon stone early main quest. I was able to defeat bandits pretty easily but when I fought that Bandit Chief in the fort in Joining the Legion quest I was essentially a weak fighter. Blocking works but only so well because health is diminished with each blow and my counter blows just could not keep up. To boot, stamina is used up so quickly it makes multiple moves impossible. Are certain enemies going to make you feel weak regardless? And I ask this knowing that potions and magic can be used but don't wan't to use them.

Additionally, has anyone found that getting in blows without getting hit is kind of hard? Like it's hard to get off a clean blow without being countered? Seems like enemies get off blows easier than I can.

Thanks,

VFN

 

[Agent007]

I normally use shield-and-war axe, and I never have any problems. I'm also (currently) level 7, btw.

 

[Start Dale]

I've tried to develop sword and shield techniques but I can't get the patience to grind past the point you are describing. So I tend to stick to 2 handed battleaxes as doing that at least makes me feel like I am doing more. I will say that you will still encounter enemies that will suddenly take you out before you have a chance to do anything about it. I find in that case it is best to try and run circles around them and back off as well so they land less blows on you, this strategy is easier I think with 2 handed as the shield and sword route makes it feel like you can stand your ground. But try dodging and running round enemies while fighting so they will make less contact overall. Hope you keep at the sword and shield as I reckon once you get some more perks on that it will really work out for you.

Just got my arse handed to me by a 'Keeper' in the Soul Cairn and i'm a level 49 2 handed heavy armour walking death machine in most cases. So it still happens, some things get easier to take down other things level up with you or even ahead of your progress so they will always be harder to beat than anything else about you. One of the good things about his game, even when you get high in the level stakes there are still creatures that will out power you forcing you to adapt a new strategy.

 

[Lightningfalcon]

Sword and shield never works for me i find taking them out with dual wield or 2 handed before they lay a hand on me the best.

I get torn apart with a sword and shield.

 

[VFN]

I normally use shield-and-war axe, and I never have any problems. I'm also (currently) level 7, btw.

You've fought Bandit Chiefs without potions, magic or help? How do do that?

What about defense, staying alive Lightningfalcon?

 

[AS88]

Sword and Shield, with Heavy Armour allows for the best defensive-based fighters in the game (without magic). I've played numerous no-magic warriors and have found that using a shield is easily the most effective way to avoid getting killed.

It does take practice, though. First of all, you should be hoping to not get hit at all, and taking a hit with your shield down should be your last resort. Fights with these guys last longer than with other styles, but if you learn how to play it effectively, you should be hard to stop on anything less than Master

EDIT: Also, if Stamina is a major concern for you, consider a Redguard - their Adrenaline Rush power should be enough to get you past that one Bandit Chief you might come across.

 

[VFN]

Sword and Shield, with Heavy Armour allows for the best defensive-based fighters in the game (without magic). I've played numerous no-magic warriors and have found that using a shield is easily the most effective way to avoid getting killed.

It does take practice, though. First of all, you should be hoping to not get hit at all, and taking a hit with your shield down should be your last resort. Fights with these guys last longer than with other styles, but if you learn how to play it effectively, you should be hard to stop on anything less than Master

EDIT: Also, if Stamina is a major concern for you, consider a Redguard - their Adrenaline Rush power should be enough to get you past that one Bandit Chief you might come across.

Yeah, practice. But even then if you make a few mistakes you're in trouble, right? And I ask this in reference to my OP in that one handed seems to have much less damage output than a strong enemy like a chief. Even you don't make a mistake and block all minor blows and dodge power ones you're still losing more health than you're taking off the enemy right, which is a major problem, and you're going to make some mistakes sometimes. And so this is problem, yes?

 

[Janus3003]

My main character uses sword and shield with heavy armor. I've cranked his stamina quite a bit, and I find it's easier to get a clean shot in by using a powered shield bash.
Heck, shield bashes in general are both useful and a lot of fun.

 

[AS88]

Yeah, practice. But even then if you make a few mistakes you're in trouble, right? And I ask this in reference to my OP in that one handed seems to have much less damage output than a strong enemy like a chief. Even you don't make a mistake and block all minor blows and dodge power ones you're still losing more health than you're taking off the enemy right, which is a major problem, and you're going to make some mistakes sometimes. And so this is problem, yes?

That's not so much a problem with the playstyle, more the game mechanics at higher levels. No matter what weapon you used, you would still do less damage than a corresponding Bandit Chief with the same one, same goes for magic.

 

[VFN]

That's not so much a problem with the playstyle, more the game mechanics at higher levels. No matter what weapon you used, you would still do less damage than a corresponding Bandit Chief with the same one, same goes for magic.

So that leaves you with having to use help, whether it be magic, potions or a follower when you're dealing with a superior enemy, yes?

And I was just playing around with trying to dodge enemies in the Bleak Falls Barrow and dodging is not so easy, and seems something you can't rely on.

I've been playing this game for a while and can't really move on and it dawned on me that maybe I'm trying to play it unlike it was meant to be played. That is, maybe Bethesda wants you to take followers, use potions, use magic, because a certain build alone won't always work. I've read about the possible builds in this game, read the forums, and it seems that every build has weaknesses which seems to demonstrate that you do have to compensate in some fashion. So maybe I have to change my expectations. Then again, I'm sure there are those highly talented people out there that can negotiate the combat without any aid but there's always those people.

 

[AS88]

So that leaves you with having to use help, whether it be magic, potions or a follower when you're dealing with a superior enemy, yes?

And I was just playing around with trying to dodge enemies in the Bleak Falls Barrow and dodging is not so easy, and seems something you can't rely on.

I've been playing this game for a while and can't really move on and it dawned on me that maybe I'm trying to play it unlike it was meant to be played. That is, maybe Bethesda wants you to take followers, use potions, use magic, because a certain build alone won't always work. I've read about the possible builds in this game, read the forums, and it seems that every build has weaknesses which seems to demonstrate that you do have to compensate in some fashion. So maybe I have to change my expectations. Then again, I'm sure there are those highly talented people out there that can negotiate the combat without any aid but there's always those people.

I've played a sword & shield warrior with no magic, no follower, potions very rarely on expert difficulty up to around level 45 (at which point both 1h and block skills are at 100). It's all about patience and learning the game. I bought Skyrim on release day, and still play, so maybe it's just experience, but I have played pretty much any build you can think of, and sword & shield is a style I consistently find myself going back to

 

[khazan99]

My main character uses sword and shield with heavy armor. I've cranked his stamina quite a bit, and I find it's easier to get a clean shot in by using a powered shield bash.
Heck, shield bashes in general are both useful and a lot of fun.

This is a great point. Bashing with a shield almost always staggers the enemy back a few steps, and, when you asked earlier about when to get in your attacks, this is the time to step in and strike the opponent.

I initially just 'turtled' behind the shield and tried to swing when I could, but using the shield as a bashing weapon opens things up for you to get in a good clean strike. Consider climbing the Block skill tree to get Power Bash.

The other thing I switched up was wearing Light Armor rather than Heavy - it makes a difference when trying to move around, although it can sometimes be a subtle difference.

Finally, early on, any Bandit Chief can end your day pretty quickly. Don't necessarily feel like you're doing something wrong, because they can be really tough. They usually are tanked up in Heavy Armor and sometimes like to use 2-handed weapons, so they hit hard. And, since you usually have to plow through their flunkies to get to them, you can get overwhelmed/weakened pretty easily. I think I died 4 times in a row to the same Bandit Chief in Teva's Watch one evening and I was really annoyed.

And no, I usually don't bother with a follower either because they more often than not just clutter up combat space or do something dumb anyway. I do tend to use potions early and often though - they're no good just sitting in my inventory so I use them a lot.

 

[Janus3003]

And the best thing about shield bashing is the awesome finishing move:

 

[AS88]

And the best thing about shield bashing is the awesome finishing move:

Dat second one...

 

[VFN]

My question about being weak most definitely applies to higher level opponents like a Bandit Chief. For instance, in Joining the Legion quest I entered the prison building and was attacked by three bandits. I was able to get through them without any health-up. But the Bandit Chief was very difficult. I know that shield bash or power bash is a good tactic but the problem is that you run out of stamina and don't have enough damage output to go one- on-one with these tougher opponents. I fooled around with two-handed and found that they do way more damage but the problem here is that until I find the right enchantments I'm very vulnerable to magic, tough archers and dragons.

I was thinking of making a sneak/archer/one-handed. In that way I could use melee as last resort and hopefully have taken enough health away from a tough opponent using the bow or dagger that melee is pretty easy. But that takes a lot of perks and could kind of gimp me early and mid-game. I know some people use dual wield with their archer/sneak but I'm not sure about that.

 

[khazan99]

My question about being weak most definitely applies to higher level opponents like a Bandit Chief. For instance, in Joining the Legion quest I entered the prison building and was attacked by three bandits. I was able to get through them without any health-up. But the Bandit Chief was very difficult. I know that shield bash or power bash is a good tactic but the problem is that you run out of stamina and don't have enough damage output to go one- on-one with these tougher opponents.

Vegetable Soup is your savior.

Cabbage, potato, leek, tomato. Gather as many of these items as you can and cook them to make vegetable soup. It restores one point of Health and Stamina every second for 720 seconds (12 minutes).

One point of each every second? Sounds pathetic right? Yes, but the key here is that the mechanics of power bashing / power attacking require only one point of Stamina to work. As long as you have even just one point of Stamina in that little green bar in the lower right hand corner of your screen, you can power bash. So load up on Vegetable Soup and you can keep bashing that ugly Bandit Chief in his stupid face.

Another point is that where you fight these guys is as important as how you fight them. Find choke points (doorways, rocky landscape features, immobile crates, wagons barrels, etc) and use them to hedge the enemy in and/or keep yourself from being flanked or overrrun. Soften them up from a distance with a bow, enchanted or poisoned if you can.

And yes, sometimes these fights go on for a long time. Hope this helps, don't get discouraged! Best of luck and have fun!

 

[Clau]

Investing in quick reflexes perk allows you ample time to block a power attack by bandit chiefs. Those hurt a lot with lower level characters. Staggering that bandit chief or dodging when time slows down then using a power attack of your own will make the battle much quicker.

 

[Start Dale]

With the advice on this thread I think I may try out the sword and shield route again.

Cheers guys.

 

[VFN]

Investing in quick reflexes perk allows you ample time to block a power attack by bandit chiefs. Those hurt a lot with lower level characters. Staggering that bandit chief or dodging when time slows down then using a power attack of your own will make the battle much quicker.

Yes I've tried that and things can still be tough due to stamina, damage taken even when blocking regular hits and the minimal damage that a one-hander seems to dish out for tough enemies. Maybe as I've seen elsewhere Bandit Chiefs, along with some other enemies, are simply overpowered. If that's the case than maybe it becomes okay to use potions, magic, or followers to even the playing field?

 

[Stigweard Ruadhan]

I like axe and sword for the aesthetic beauty of it...

But often fall back on a two handed warhammer when it seems to be lacking that oomph!