Arguments in Defense of the Empire

[stagnant94]

How about this then? the races of Skyrim are there because they Belong there. The empire is in charge at this point and who originally settled there is of no consequence. Happy?

moderately, i still don't like your reasoning, i believe in self determination, ironic that i'm an imperial? i only support them because my hatred of nationalism and racism is stronger than my belief in self determination. the lesser of two evils

 

[TheRedGoblin]

Well to your first point. If you follow Ralof you can get revenge on the woman that ordered your execution. After that me and the Empire were cool again... well I did kill some soldiers on the road just to make sure I got all my anger out.

As far as the second point goes, the Empire was not really enforcing the ban on Talos worship until Ulfirc killed the High King. So really its his fault.

 

[Jeremius]

Well to your first point. If you follow Ralof you can get revenge on the woman that ordered your execution. After that me and the Empire were cool again... well I did kill some soldiers on the road just to make sure I got all my anger out.

As far as the second point goes, the Empire was not really enforcing the ban on Talos worship until Ulfirc killed the High King. So really its his fault.

They are still not enforcing it. Rikke, Torygg, and the EMPEROR himself all worship Talos despite the ban. The bolded is the Thalmor because the empire is too lazy/inept to do anything about it.

 

[Chowder138]

I don't see why you have to even bother to defend the Empire. They're the good guys here. Stormcloaks = Selfish, racist pricks.

Both sides are need to get over themselves -_-. I hate the Empire cause they turned into spineless wimps that couldn't handle ONE country of these stuck up elves (Seriously, the fight could have been 6 to 3 if you take into consideration that the Thalmor control Elswyer and Valenwood. GET REINFORCEMENTS EMPIRE!!!). We're talking about elves that are both the physically weakest, and the weakest in magical resistance! Just hit them first... or silence them... You know, use TACTICAL warfare! But I will admit, I also really hated them cause they wouldn't give the Stormcloaks a trial and in the process tried to cut my head off (I'm appearently a Dark Elf working for Nords that hate elves in general -_-). Then we have the Stormcloaks, and I thought, "Well they seem honorable enough, maybe I should join them!"... Nope. Get to Windhelm, find them treating the Dunmer and Argonians like the scum of the earth, and then they all continuously pair me up with the Thalmor... Not the best way to win someone over. Though I do have multiple characters: one neutral, one stormcloak, and one empire. that way I get the majority of perspectives.
But I do get where you are going. The Empire used to be our friend, but then is put in a bad light at the very beginning of the game. kind of a troll for them huh?

This post is so chock-full of fail and stupidity, I'm not going to even try to point them all out.

 

[Hargood]

They are still not enforcing it. Rikke, Torygg, and the EMPEROR himself all worship Talos despite the ban. The bolded is the Thalmor because the empire is too lazy/inept to do anything about it.

I wouldn't say "Lazy". There is this War going on ya know?

 

[Jeremius]

I wouldn't say "Lazy". There is this War going on ya know?

Still the empire is not enforcing the ban on it's own people. If they were, the Empire would get a lot smaller, due to the fact that there are likely members throughout the empire who still worship Talos.

 

[Docta Corvina]

It's becoming more and more clear to me that the Empire really is in one of those lamentable "damned if you do, damned if you don't" positions. Because with all of the displeasure with the signing of the Concordat (not saying displeasure is totally unjustified), there's apparently still the feeling that the Empire is "lazy" or incapable of doing its job - when we all know that if it HAD been enforcing it more proactively, people would have faulted them for that even more vigorously.

To me, the lack of enforcement is further proof that it doesn't appreciate the Thalmor, even daring to disobey it right under its nose. That takes some stones, man. That's certainly not the sign of a weak and cowardly Empire.

 

[stagnant94]

It's becoming more and more clear to me that the Empire really is in one of those lamentable "damned if you do, damned if you don't" positions. Because with all of the displeasure with the signing of the Concordat (not saying displeasure is totally unjustified), there's apparently still the feeling that the Empire is "lazy" or incapable of doing its job - when we all know that if it HAD been enforcing it more proactively, people would have faulted them for that even more vigorously.

To me, the lack of enforcement is further proof that it doesn't appreciate the Thalmor, even daring to disobey it right under its nose. That takes some stones, man. That's certainly not the sign of a weak and cowardly Empire.

but it does mean that if given the opportunity they will fight the thalmor again, i mean they haven't made friends with anyone other than high elves. the wood elves are prone to rebelling against them nearly as much as the khajiit. the redguards don't like them, neither do the nords or imperials. The Bretons, dark elves and argonians could be convinced. if everyone fights together then everything will be way more epic.


Edit: why did someone rate this funny?

 

[Smokejensen]

Both sides are need to get over themselves -_-. I hate the Empire cause they turned into spineless wimps that couldn't handle ONE country of these stuck up elves (Seriously, the fight could have been 6 to 3 if you take into consideration that the Thalmor control Elswyer and Valenwood. GET REINFORCEMENTS EMPIRE!!!). We're talking about elves that are both the physically weakest, and the weakest in magical resistance! Just hit them first... or silence them... You know, use TACTICAL warfare! But I will admit, I also really hated them cause they wouldn't give the Stormcloaks a trial and in the process tried to cut my head off (I'm appearently a Dark Elf working for Nords that hate elves in general -_-). Then we have the Stormcloaks, and I thought, "Well they seem honorable enough, maybe I should join them!"... Nope. Get to Windhelm, find them treating the Dunmer and Argonians like the scum of the earth, and then they all continuously pair me up with the Thalmor... Not the best way to win someone over. Though I do have multiple characters: one neutral, one stormcloak, and one empire. that way I get the majority of perspectives.
But I do get where you are going. The Empire used to be our friend, but then is put in a bad light at the very beginning of the game. kind of a troll for them huh?

Ive seen stormclocks vs thalmor and Elite penitus Oculatus vs Thalmor justiciars fight on youtube and thalmor won each time.... Empire + stormclocks vs thalmor more then likely win... Empire has problems everyone agrees to that... And the Stormclocks do too, but a civil war is not the way.. So im neutral cause i joined the stormclocks once and captured whiterun and Jarl balgruf talked to me.... i was pissed at myshelf for helping the stormclocks and then went back before i joined up and left windhelm and became neutral..... personal when i say i went back i like to say i went back in time .

 

[stagnant94]

i'm a redguard, so i don't really care at all about your damned conflict. but if i had to choose i go for the empire because the stormcloaks are racist

 

[Google]

Empire and Stormclocks. Thalmor and Dragons. It's all up to the Dragonborn to help, save, serve, and destroy whatever he or she wants too in the lands of Skyrim. It's not in our ability to say who the better is when we are obviously not the Dragonborn, as the favored side could be destroyed at any moment by the power of the voice, the clashing of steel, and the fury of magika. Then again, one of us could be the Dragonborn, but we just don't know it yet...
It's something to ponder, I guess.

 

[Smokejensen]

Empire and Stormclocks. Thalmor and Dragons. It's all up to the Dragonborn to help, save, serve, and destroy whatever he or she wants too in the lands of Skyrim. It's not in our ability to say who the better is when we are obviously not the Dragonborn, as the favored side could be destroyed at any moment by the power of the voice, the clashing of steel, and the fury of magika. Then again, one of us could be the Dragonborn, but we just don't know it yet...
It's something to ponder, I guess.

But we do know this..... the dragonborn will be a badass no matter what

 

[Raijin]

Raijin, you've seen my posts time and time again in all of these threads. Why would you say you've never read my pro-Empire arguments?

What I was musing about doing was making my own personal manifesto of sorts, complete with lore references/citations, the whole lot. That will take time and attention. But for the meantime, please see any of the CW threads for my beliefs and arguments.

I might of read your post but not everyone here has It was you that mention that you were going to write up why you support the empire, didn't you? What was the point of making the post if you didn't really mean it? I'm not the only Pro-Stormcloak here.

That is what I'm interested in hearing, I'm sure others are too since they're encouraging you to write one up Since you have wealth of knowledge regarding to lore it would be very educating.

girly picture

 

[Docta Corvina]

I might of read your post but not everyone here has It was you that mention that you were going to write up why you support the empire, didn't you? What was the point of making the post if you didn't really mean it? I'm not the only Pro-Stormcloak here.

That is what I'm interested in hearing, I'm sure others are too since they're encouraging you to write one up Since you have wealth of knowledge regarding to lore it would be very educating.

Raijin, man, first of all, you just posted that you were waiting to hear my arguments in favor of the Empire, seeming to suggest that I've not made myself clear many times already. My reply was that you can find them on the appropriate threads. As can anyone else. I'm well aware that you're not the only Stormcloak here. Believe me, I know. And I'm actually pretty sure they've seen my posts on the topic as well, since we all seem to find and frequent the same threads.

To the second point about my treatise post, I never said I wasn't going to do it. Where did you get that notion? I just prefer to take my time and not half ass it. I could shoot from the hip on it if I desired to, but I want to treat it as a serious bit that I devote time and attention to. If you're serious about reading it, then you should be just fine with me taking time to develop it. I happen to have a full time job that demands most of my time during the weekdays, and I'm writing a lengthy Skyrim prose work in my free time. I will get to it, but don't expect me to pull it out of my magic Imperial hat tonight or anytime imminently soon.

And lol, I never, EVER claimed to be a lore wizard. So please don't try to paint me as one. I simply do research so I'm that much better informed. You can't discuss the present circumstances as fruitfully without at all considering the historical antecedents.

 

[Jersey Dagmar]

I might of read your post but not everyone here has It was you that mention that you were going to write up why you support the empire, didn't you? What was the point of making the post if you didn't really mean it? I'm not the only Pro-Stormcloak here.

That is what I'm interested in hearing, I'm sure others are too since they're encouraging you to write one up Since you have wealth of knowledge regarding to lore it would be very educating.

At this point, we shouldn't have to write a long drawn out essay as to why we support the Empire. You should have instead have thoroughly understood our arguments and points the countless times we posted them.

Reading comprehension, it does wonders.

 

[Jeremius]

At this point, we shouldn't have to write a long drawn out essay as to why we support the Empire. You should have instead have thoroughly understood our arguments and points the countless times we posted them.

Reading comprehension, it does wonders.

Please leave this thread 11th Doctor, I would rather not have a war between you and Raijin. Just so you know, I am of the position that Tulius and Ulfric should jump off the top of the College of Winterhold. My reason is:

1. The empire is at this point in the "Road to hell is paved with good Intentions" situation. Signing the White-Gold Concordant, no matter how noble the intention, is wrong as it limits the freedom of your Citizens.
2. Ulfric may be a racist (Have no concrete proof other than what people show me where I see warmonger first). He is Definitely a warmonger though, and not a good choice for high King. The rebellion is fighting a weak and Tyrannical Empire, indirectly enslaved by elves, this is good, but doing so to get your boss the throne is not a good reason to do so.

Get what I am saying?

 

[Raijin]

Raijin, man, first of all, you just posted that you were waiting to hear my arguments in favor of the Empire, seeming to suggest that I've not made myself clear many times already. My reply was that you can find them on the appropriate threads. As can anyone else. I'm well aware that you're not the only Stormcloak here. Believe me, I know. And I'm actually pretty sure they've seen my posts on the topic as well, since we all seem to find and frequent the same threads.

To the second point about my treatise post, I never said I wasn't going to do it. Where did you get that notion? I just prefer to take my time and not half ass it. I could shoot from the hip on it if I desired to, but I want to treat it as a serious bit that I devote time and attention to. If you're serious about reading it, then you should be just fine with me taking time to develop it. I happen to have a full time job that demands most of my time during the weekdays, and I'm writing a lengthy Skyrim prose work in my free time. I will get to it, but don't expect me to pull it out of my magic Imperial hat tonight or anytime imminently soon.

And lol, I never, EVER claimed to be a lore wizard. So please don't try to paint me as one. I simply do research so I'm that much better informed. You can't discuss the present circumstances as fruitfully without at all considering the historical antecedents.

Going back and re reading that long endless thread is time consuming. To be honest with you it's like entering in an endless nightmare. Like you I also have a busy RL life, and I just can't take the time to read from page 1 all the way to page 70??? I'm not sure how long that thread lasted, but it took quite a few pages. In some respects is like reading the DMV booklet.

Anyhow I'm not going to argue over this. I will have to wait

At this point, we shouldn't have to write a long drawn out essay as to why we support the Empire. You should have instead have thoroughly understood our arguments and points the countless times we posted them.
Reading comprehension, it does wonders.

For someone who likes to pin point others lack of reading comprehension I am shame of you, really. Have you even read all of what was posted on this thread or did you just read what I just wrote? It was samgurl775 that suggest that everyone that supports the empire should get together and write an essay on why they support the empire. If you think that's nonsense then perhaps you should be telling her that instead of me?

In case if you didn't read what she wrote I will gladly post you the exact quote so you can read it yourself.

I think all of us that support the Empire (and there are a lot of us, and it's always the same people in these threads) should get together and just write a huge, long winded explanation that debunks all of the nonsense "Dark Elves are lazy" "The Empire is spineless" "One woman wanted to kill me, therefore the whole Empire sucks" arguments. And then spam every Empire vs Stormcloaks with our "Long Live the Empire" essay.

 

[Raijin]

1. Ulfric may be a racist (Have no concrete proof other than what people show me where I see warmonger first). He is Definitely a warmonger though, and not a good choice for high King. The rebellion is fighting a weak and Tyrannical Empire, indirectly enslaved by elves, this is good, but doing so to get your boss the throne is not a good reason to do so.

Ulfric isn't a racist. Why is everyone keep saying that? I never heard him say anything bad torwards the Dark elves, or to any other race for that matters. Hes at war against the empire because he wants skyrims independence. He feels that Skyrim is better off without the empire, and perhaps he might be right? The empire is responsible for the thalmor presence in Skyrim Because of the treaty. Hammerfell was in the same position, and they fought off the thalmor and force the empire to give them Independence.

I guess hes guilty for being a warmonger when hes fighting for Skyrims freedom from a broken down empire.

 

[Jeremius]

Ulfric isn't a racist. Why is everyone keep saying that? I never heard him say anything bad torwards the Dark elves, or to any other race for that matters. Hes at war against the empire because he wants skyrims independence. He feels that Skyrim is better off without the empire, and perhaps he might be right? The empire is responsible for the thalmor presence in Skyrim Because of the treaty. Hammerfell was in the same position, and they fought off the thalmor and force the empire to give them Independence.

I guess hes guilty for being a warmonger when hes fighting for Skyrims freedom from a broken down empire.

He may not be a good choice for high king because of his being a warmonger. What will he do after the Dominion is defeated? He may war against his "Allies".

Re-read the parentheses again, I have no Actual evidence and the evidence people give me are their biased opinions at best.

 

[Google]

I've been reading Empire vs Stormclock vs Whatever threads for a long time now, and it's gotten pretty boring. All they manage to do is to get everyone mad at each other.

If you ask me they, these threads all end up like this post I found.