Imperials or Stormcloaks, what one?

[Lewsean]

Showed what type of man he is under pressure. I like how Ulfric actually closed the door to the tower, may just be me... But I don't think Dragons use the front door.

Fair trial? Show me one instance in TES lore of someone being given a trial over High Treason.

Lokir: "Ulfric? The Jarl of Windhelm? You're the leader of the rebellion. But if they've captured you... Oh gods, where are they taking us?"
Ralof: "I don't know where we're going, but Sovngarde awaits."

They seemed to know death was coming before they even arrived at Helgen.

I thought the whole concept of imperial law is that your guilty until proven innocent? How come Ulfric didn't get a chance to do that? To prove his innocence? The Empire wanted to silence Ulfric... To hush him up so that others don't see the true tyranny that the empire truly is. The fact to the matter is that people are fed up with poor leadership of the Empire, and the Empire doesn't want people being reminded just how much of a failure that they are.


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Martial Law. Gen Tullius is the military Gov. Summary executions are authorized. That's why. Have no sympathy for Ulfric because he alone plunged Skyrim into civil unrest after killing High King Torygg and cared not for the law or for civil order of Provincial Gov.

Funny none of these other Provinces are running for the door. Morrowind seems to want East Empire Co around very badly, Highrock doesn't agree with Ulfric.

Nice try.

The Empire caused the civil war by signing the "treaty". There would've been civil war in Hammerfell too but you cowards gave up on them before they had a chance.

 

[LegateFasendil]

The Legion has been known to escort refugees and civilians from disaster/war zones. They also sometimes escort trade shipments.

They're not biased in that they only will protect nobles.

You're also known to "escort" citizens of Skyrim to their deaths for worshiping their God. Tyrants.

Those are Stormcloaks, Legion didn't enforce the ban on Talos past an official level. Thalmor confirm this.

 

[LegateFasendil]

I thought the whole concept of imperial law is that your guilty until proven innocent? How come Ulfric didn't get a chance to do that? To prove his innocence? The Empire wanted to silence Ulfric... To hush him up so that others don't see the true tyranny that the empire truly is. The fact to the matter is that people are fed up with poor leadership of the Empire, and the Empire doesn't want people being reminded just how much of a failure that they are.


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Martial Law. Gen Tullius is the military Gov. Summary executions are authorized. That's why. Have no sympathy for Ulfric because he alone plunged Skyrim into civil unrest after killing High King Torygg and cared not for the law or for civil order of Provincial Gov.

Funny none of these other Provinces are running for the door. Morrowind seems to want East Empire Co around very badly, Highrock doesn't agree with Ulfric.

Nice try.

The Empire caused the civil war by signing the "treaty". There would've been civil war in Hammerfell too but you cowards gave up on them before they had a chance.

No, Hammerfell was a very different case altogether. If you understood the Redguards and their history with the Empire better you would not have made this association.

I don't think the Empire allowing them to leave is cowardice. Having all those Nords die so you can be High King is the mark of a coward however.

 

[Lewsean]

Martial Law. Gen Tullius is the military Gov. Summary executions are authorized. That's why. Have no sympathy for Ulfric because he alone plunged Skyrim into civil unrest after killing High King Torygg and cared not for the law or for civil order of Provincial Gov.

Funny none of these other Provinces are running for the door. Morrowind seems to want East Empire Co around very badly, Highrock doesn't agree with Ulfric.

Nice try.

The Empire caused the civil war by signing the "treaty". There would've been civil war in Hammerfell too but you cowards gave up on them before they had a chance.

No, Hammerfell was a very different case altogether. If you understood the Redguards and their history with the Empire better you would not have made this association.

I don't think the Empire allowing them to leave is cowardice. Having all those Nords die so you can be High King is the mark of a coward however.

Hammerfell wasn't different at all, they refused the treaty just like Skyrim did, the only difference is the Empire left Hammerfell to it's own devices rather than killing it's citizens like you're doing in Skyrim. But having all those Nords die so you can remain Emperor isn't? Constant hypocritical arguments.

The Legion has been known to escort refugees and civilians from disaster/war zones. They also sometimes escort trade shipments.

They're not biased in that they only will protect nobles.

You're also known to "escort" citizens of Skyrim to their deaths for worshiping their God. Tyrants.

Those are Stormcloaks, Legion didn't enforce the ban on Talos past an official level. Thalmor confirm this.

Lmao what? So because you didn't arrest and hand over Talos worshippers a few years ago it makes it okay that you do it now? I guess everybody should be excused from any crime they commit because they didn't do it a year prior. It is very much enforced, Tuillius goes ape plops when Rikke whispers 'Talos be with you' if you kill Ulfric. The Empire has no respect for Skyrim/Nordic culture.

 

[Jeremius]

The Empire caused the civil war by signing the "treaty". There would've been civil war in Hammerfell too but you cowards gave up on them before they had a chance.

No, the Thalmor started this war by creating the perfect mixture that the keg blew up.

 

[Lewsean]

The Empire caused the civil war by signing the "treaty". There would've been civil war in Hammerfell too but you cowards gave up on them before they had a chance.

No, the Thalmor started this war by creating the perfect mixture that the keg blew up.

No. You started this war by accepting conditions that were obviously going to lead to what's happening now. Selling out regions and accepting the outlawing of sacred traditions, and you really thought people would be okay with that?

 

[Jeremius]

No. You started this war by accepting conditions that were obviously going to lead to what's happening now. Selling out regions and accepting the outlawing of sacred traditions, and you really thought people would be okay with that?

None of this war would be happening if the Thalmor did not stick their collective nose in where it did not belong.

The Empire turned a blind eye to Talos worship until the Thalmor found out that the Empire was letting you Nords worship your god and manipulated everything so the war WOULD happen.

 

[Lewsean]

No. You started this war by accepting conditions that were obviously going to lead to what's happening now. Selling out regions and accepting the outlawing of sacred traditions, and you really thought people would be okay with that?

None of this war would be happening if the Thalmor did not stick their collective nose in where it did not belong.

The Empire turned a blind eye to Talos worship until the Thalmor found out that the Empire was letting you Nords worship your god and manipulated everything so the war WOULD happen.

If that truely is the case then it further strengthens the claims that the Empire is nothing more than a puppet of the Thalmor and you're not the savior to mankind like many suggest. The Empire didn't let anybody worship Talos, it was the Jarl of Markarth, the Empire went with it so they could reclaim Markarth then proceeded to arrest Ulfric and his men.

 

[Jeremius]

No. You started this war by accepting conditions that were obviously going to lead to what's happening now. Selling out regions and accepting the outlawing of sacred traditions, and you really thought people would be okay with that?

None of this war would be happening if the Thalmor did not stick their collective nose in where it did not belong.

The Empire turned a blind eye to Talos worship until the Thalmor found out that the Empire was letting you Nords worship your god and manipulated everything so the war WOULD happen.

If that truely is the case then it further strengthens the claims that the Empire is nothing more than a puppet of the Thalmor and you're not the savior to mankind like many suggest. The Empire didn't let anybody worship Talos, it was the Jarl of Markarth, the Empire went with it so they could reclaim Markarth then proceeded to arrest Ulfric and his men.

Listen to Alvor, the blacksmith in Riverwood. He said that everyone had their little shrines to Talos, and none of this was really a problem until people started whining about it, which got the Thalmor involved. Sounds like to me that the Empire was not bothering to do the job the ban was telling them to.

 

[Jurgarik Greycloak]

None of this war would be happening if the Thalmor did not stick their collective nose in where it did not belong.

The Empire turned a blind eye to Talos worship until the Thalmor found out that the Empire was letting you Nords worship your god and manipulated everything so the war WOULD happen.

If that truely is the case then it further strengthens the claims that the Empire is nothing more than a puppet of the Thalmor and you're not the savior to mankind like many suggest. The Empire didn't let anybody worship Talos, it was the Jarl of Markarth, the Empire went with it so they could reclaim Markarth then proceeded to arrest Ulfric and his men.

Listen to Alvor, the blacksmith in Riverwood. He said that everyone had their little shrines to Talos, and none of this was really a problem until people started whining about it, which got the Thalmor involved. Sounds like to me that the Empire was not bothering to do the job the ban was telling them to.

You are both being stupid. All three factions (Empire, Thalmor, and Stormcloaks) started this War. The Empire for allowing the ban to be enforced, the Thamor for setting the fire trap that was the war, and the Stormcloaks for overreacting to something so stupid.

 

[Lewsean]

If that truely is the case then it further strengthens the claims that the Empire is nothing more than a puppet of the Thalmor and you're not the savior to mankind like many suggest. The Empire didn't let anybody worship Talos, it was the Jarl of Markarth, the Empire went with it so they could reclaim Markarth then proceeded to arrest Ulfric and his men.

Listen to Alvor, the blacksmith in Riverwood. He said that everyone had their little shrines to Talos, and none of this was really a problem until people started whining about it, which got the Thalmor involved. Sounds like to me that the Empire was not bothering to do the job the ban was telling them to.

You are both being stupid. All three factions (Empire, Thalmor, and Stormcloaks) started this War. The Empire for allowing the ban to be enforced, the Thamor for setting the fire trap that was the war, and the Stormcloaks for overreacting to something so stupid.

"Overreacting to something so stupid".. Culture and history aren't stupid, stupid to think a race of people who take their way of life very seriously would just lay down and take it. I'm sure if Christianity or Islam was banned it would be the exact same situation. There's no justification to stripping a people of their tradition, no matter how hard you try too.

 

[LegateFasendil]

Listen to Alvor, the blacksmith in Riverwood. He said that everyone had their little shrines to Talos, and none of this was really a problem until people started whining about it, which got the Thalmor involved. Sounds like to me that the Empire was not bothering to do the job the ban was telling them to.

You are both being stupid. All three factions (Empire, Thalmor, and Stormcloaks) started this War. The Empire for allowing the ban to be enforced, the Thamor for setting the fire trap that was the war, and the Stormcloaks for overreacting to something so stupid.

"Overreacting to something so stupid".. Culture and history aren't stupid, stupid to think a race of people who take their way of life very seriously would just lay down and take it. I'm sure if Christianity or Islam was banned it would be the exact same situation. There's no justification to stripping a people of their tradition, no matter how hard you try too.

Culture and sometimes Religion can change though. At least half of the Nords in Skyrim would disagree with the above statement.

The Empire means more to them than "getting what they deserve", they are willing to sacrifice because of their faith.

 

[Lewsean]

You are both being stupid. All three factions (Empire, Thalmor, and Stormcloaks) started this War. The Empire for allowing the ban to be enforced, the Thamor for setting the fire trap that was the war, and the Stormcloaks for overreacting to something so stupid.

"Overreacting to something so stupid".. Culture and history aren't stupid, stupid to think a race of people who take their way of life very seriously would just lay down and take it. I'm sure if Christianity or Islam was banned it would be the exact same situation. There's no justification to stripping a people of their tradition, no matter how hard you try too.

Culture and sometimes Religion can change though. At least half of the Nords in Skyrim would disagree with the above statement.

The Empire means more to them than "getting what they deserve", they are willing to sacrifice because of their faith.

Name one religion that has changed their God, lol. And no, most Nords in Skyrim agree. You'll find Stormcloak sympathizers in nearly every Imperial hold, but how many Imperial supports do you find in Stormcloak holds? The Empire hasn't sacrificed anything, everybody else has gotten the short end of the stick apart from you guys.

 

[LegateFasendil]

"Overreacting to something so stupid".. Culture and history aren't stupid, stupid to think a race of people who take their way of life very seriously would just lay down and take it. I'm sure if Christianity or Islam was banned it would be the exact same situation. There's no justification to stripping a people of their tradition, no matter how hard you try too.

Culture and sometimes Religion can change though. At least half of the Nords in Skyrim would disagree with the above statement.

The Empire means more to them than "getting what they deserve", they are willing to sacrifice because of their faith.

Name one religion that has changed their God, lol. And no, most Nords in Skyrim agree. You'll find Stormcloak sympathizers in nearly every Imperial hold, but how many Imperial supports do you find in Stormcloak holds? The Empire hasn't sacrificed anything, everybody else has gotten the short end of the stick apart from you guys.

Luther's 95 Theses

Which later on led to Protestanism and the Church of England.

 

[LegateFasendil]

"Overreacting to something so stupid".. Culture and history aren't stupid, stupid to think a race of people who take their way of life very seriously would just lay down and take it. I'm sure if Christianity or Islam was banned it would be the exact same situation. There's no justification to stripping a people of their tradition, no matter how hard you try too.

Culture and sometimes Religion can change though. At least half of the Nords in Skyrim would disagree with the above statement.

The Empire means more to them than "getting what they deserve", they are willing to sacrifice because of their faith.

Name one religion that has changed their God, lol. And no, most Nords in Skyrim agree. You'll find Stormcloak sympathizers in nearly every Imperial hold, but how many Imperial supports do you find in Stormcloak holds? The Empire hasn't sacrificed anything, everybody else has gotten the short end of the stick apart from you guys.

Half of the Nords in Skyrim disagree with you. All those lives lost just so the Empire could sign the WGC disagree with you. Not to mention High King Istlad, a true Nord (according to Ulfric) who approved the WGC.

They all collectively put the Empire first.

 

[Lewsean]

Culture and sometimes Religion can change though. At least half of the Nords in Skyrim would disagree with the above statement.

The Empire means more to them than "getting what they deserve", they are willing to sacrifice because of their faith.

Name one religion that has changed their God, lol. And no, most Nords in Skyrim agree. You'll find Stormcloak sympathizers in nearly every Imperial hold, but how many Imperial supports do you find in Stormcloak holds? The Empire hasn't sacrificed anything, everybody else has gotten the short end of the stick apart from you guys.

Half of the Nords in Skyrim disagree with you. All those lives lost just so the Empire could sign the WGC disagree with you. Not to mention High King Istlad, a true Nord (according to Ulfric) who approved the WGC.

They all collectively put the Empire first.

Ulfric put the Empire first.. Until the Empire put everybody else LAST. And like I said before, you're wrong about half of the Nords disagreeing. Visit every hold in Skyrim, talk to the NORDIC citizens then come back here

 

[Jurgarik Greycloak]

Listen to Alvor, the blacksmith in Riverwood. He said that everyone had their little shrines to Talos, and none of this was really a problem until people started whining about it, which got the Thalmor involved. Sounds like to me that the Empire was not bothering to do the job the ban was telling them to.

You are both being stupid. All three factions (Empire, Thalmor, and Stormcloaks) started this War. The Empire for allowing the ban to be enforced, the Thamor for setting the fire trap that was the war, and the Stormcloaks for overreacting to something so stupid.

"Overreacting to something so stupid".. Culture and history aren't stupid, stupid to think a race of people who take their way of life very seriously would just lay down and take it. I'm sure if Christianity or Islam was banned it would be the exact same situation. There's no justification to stripping a people of their tradition, no matter how hard you try too.

Starting a war for a short term blessing of freedom is overreacting. You can get the same thing if you were patient and waited for the Great War. If the war goes south for Skyrim and the Empire, the Civil War was all for naught.

 

[LegateFasendil]

Name one religion that has changed their God, lol. And no, most Nords in Skyrim agree. You'll find Stormcloak sympathizers in nearly every Imperial hold, but how many Imperial supports do you find in Stormcloak holds? The Empire hasn't sacrificed anything, everybody else has gotten the short end of the stick apart from you guys.

Half of the Nords in Skyrim disagree with you. All those lives lost just so the Empire could sign the WGC disagree with you. Not to mention High King Istlad, a true Nord (according to Ulfric) who approved the WGC.

They all collectively put the Empire first.

Ulfric put the Empire first.. Until the Empire put everybody else LAST. And like I said before, you're wrong about half of the Nords disagreeing. Visit every hold in Skyrim, talk to the NORDIC citizens then come back here

How's that funny?

No, Ulfric has emotional issues and seeks what he thinks he deserves. Skyrim is NOT just made up of Nordic citizens. The Legion is full of Nords and the country including Whiterun favors Empire politically. So it's actually more than half of the population is for the Empire.

So, why don't you leave Windhelm for a while, step outside your comfort zone, and try to listen to others who don't agree with everything Ulfric tells you.

 

[Lewsean]

Half of the Nords in Skyrim disagree with you. All those lives lost just so the Empire could sign the WGC disagree with you. Not to mention High King Istlad, a true Nord (according to Ulfric) who approved the WGC.

They all collectively put the Empire first.

Ulfric put the Empire first.. Until the Empire put everybody else LAST. And like I said before, you're wrong about half of the Nords disagreeing. Visit every hold in Skyrim, talk to the NORDIC citizens then come back here

How's that funny?

No, Ulfric has emotional issues and seeks what he thinks he deserves. Skyrim is NOT just made up of Nordic citizens. The Legion is full of Nords and the country including Whiterun favors Empire politically. So it's actually more than half of the population is for the Empire.

So, why don't you leave Windhelm for a while, step outside your comfort zone, and try to listen to others who don't agree with everything Ulfric tells you.

It's not just what he thinks, which is proven by how many people support him, citizens don't bear arms without personal motivation and it was the citizens who demanded the war.

"We feel free when we escape - even if it be but from the frying pan to the fire."


Falkreath's Jarl was pushed aside for a corrupt Jarl because he's pro Imperial, Whiterun was on the fence until Tullius delivered false reports, Morthal's Jarl doesn't care either way & Markarth is owned by Stormcloak supporters. Tell me how that equals more support for the Empire? The strongest pro-imperial City of Solitude even has Thane's in the court that don't fully support the Empire.

 

[Jurgarik Greycloak]

You are all still being stupid. The Civil War is more than a puppet show for the Dominion, with the Thalmor as the puppet masters and the Imperials+Stormcloaks as the puppets.