The Great War wasn't about winning for men, or personal gain. It was defending against invaders who have come to destroy everything men had achieved. Using the Thu'um for conquest =/= Thu'um for defense.
The Graybeards only use the Thu'um for Self Defense[/quote]
And what are those times of "True Need"? hmm? do you know? I certainly don't? They're very vague about it. Chances are Ulfric being a young soldier didn't know and likely didn't use it, hoping he could still maintain the Way of the Voice. Even now, Ulfric claims the Way of the Voice is " a Wonderful Philosophy"
I'm not saying the guy's father cares. If you read through their dialogue she is blaming them, so he does become rude and sarcastic.
Exactly, so why are you still defending that. The Father is poking fun at a concerned, paranoid old woman worried about her son. Pretty dickish and irresponsible of him considering he represents the head of the Family
Does it honestly matter if we do not know their exact opinion on the man? Their families were close, one is in love with a Gray-Mane and the other inquired about his friend. Just because the two Clan leaders hate each other, it doesn't mean they all do.
Yeah, it does. how can we have feasible evidence that they care at all. Jon doesn't mention it, Alfhild doesn't and obviously Lars doesn't. Also upon reading up on the Battle Born's Idolaf isn't actually a direct descendant, but rather an in-law. This could mean Idolaf doesn't hold the exact same pride for his family that the rest of the Battle-Borns do. That info comes from here:
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Battle-Born
The Empire cares about the Empire. The Stormcloaks as a whole care about what they consider 'honor', but as Captain Aldis puts it best: "Being honorable might make you a good man, but it doesn't make you right."
And thats their problem. They will do whatever it takes to keep their Emperor's seat
Again, you believe he is innocent. They don't say if he's innocent or not, and this was just one man's test. It is about blindly carrying out orders.
Fixed that for you
The Empire doesn't teach spies to murder innocents. The Penitus Oculatus aren't just spies, they defend the Empire from espionage and threats. They're assassins too.
Obviously they do since Colins task involved: "Their recruitment process is oftentimes a brutal one, as displayed by
Inspector Colin's task to assassinate an old man. The purpose of such recruitment process was to weed out those unwilling to actually go through with
murder and other usually immoral tasks."
It is a test. To see if they will do it and how they do it, again this was just one person's test. You're right it does seem extreme, but with all the threats the Empire faces external and internal, you need people who will do the job no matter what it takes.
Colin ends up dead when he lets his guard down and begins to trust someone he believed was on his side, if I remember correctly.
What you call extreme and wrong, it is needed to survive in that line of work. Even in our modern world.
Doesn't make it right
When did the United States allow murder? You think they've never assassinated or tortured people to defend their way of life? This is normal in the world of espionage and national security.
The Penitus Oculatus does what is needed to safeguard the Empire, the Blades were the same under the Septim line.
If you're going to bring real life events into an argument about fictitious events than I have something for you later on in my post.
How much land you have doesn't make better soldiers. Training is the key here, the Stormcloaks are a militia, as Galmar puts it: We are farmers! We are craftsmen! We are sons and daughters of shopkeepers, maid servants and soldiers!
and this proves what? That they can't kill that they can't pickup a weapon? that they can't win in a fight against Imperials. Game Data says otherwise.
What? The Empire and Aldmeri Dominion will be fighting, Cyrodiil/Valenwood/Elsweyr will be front lines. Majority of the Legion is already in place on the Dominion's border.
Well there you go, not only will the Stormcloaks be fighting but so will the Empire. so what are you worrying about exactly? Also may I suggest rethinking your strategy about openly attacking Valenwood and Elsweyr, That could be a HUGE problem for an already weak Empire. or did you forget about the Wild Hunt and the Giant Tiger mounts that you said would be a big problem for us?
The Empire did fight the Aldmeri Dominion,
And barely scraped away with their lives
and the Legions did very well.
Did you mean get two legions completely decimated in the last battle of the War due to shoddy tactics. Because that's what I heard happened.
One main army was completely destroyed and the second was left weakened and on the run?
And two legions got completely destroyed! remember!? its all in this book you Imperial Boot Lickers claim to love so much:
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:The_Great_War_(book)
"Although victorious, the Imperial armies were in no shape to continue the war. The entire remaining Imperial force was gathered in Cyrodiil, exhausted and decimated by the Battle of the Red Ring. Not a single legion had more than half its soldiers fit for duty. Two legions had been effectively annihilated, not counting the loss of the Eighth during the retreat from the Imperial City the previous year."
Surprise is devastating in war, and is a major advantage. The Empire didn't have twice the strength, you have to remember;
a) The Empire was unprepared
While the Stormcloaks are ready and motivated to fight the Dominion while Imperial Auxiliaries complain about their armor being too heavy.
b) The Military was weaker and was spread across four provinces
And thats one of the advantages an Independent Skyrim has over the Empire. they won't have to worry about their Military being spread across four or three different provinces. They'll have A Unified Peoples Rebublic all defending one Fortified land separated by Snow and Mountains. Even If you win this Civil War you will still have that problem of your Military being spread across three provinces and still being weak.
c) Hammerfell was weak, divided and wasn't even prosperous for the Empire
And yet, they produced some of the greatest Warriors for The Imperial Legions. Show some respect where its due, hmm?
The Empire is now prepared, they've spent nearly three decades regaining strength and building their military for round two. Also the Imperial army is gathered where the front lines will be, instead of being very far away.
Prepared To Invade Valenwood, which as you said, is obviously Not a good Idea. Can you say: "Wild Hunt?". Wouldn't it be a better Idea to use some of that Espionage as you wholeheartedly believe the Imperials do, and assassinate The Head Thalmor agents in Valenwood, rather than rushing a couple of Legions into certain Death. Do they not remember what happened to King Borgas and his Armies? Oh of course they don't, That would require extensive research into another culture's history. Something The Empire clearly doesn't practice *cough * *cough* General Tulius *cough*
The Great War 2 is going to happen,
Yeah, Obviously
you can side with the Empire who can actually reach the Aldmeri Dominion.
You mean the same Empire that
1.) Pissed off two of its four remaining provinces after the Great War
2.) Lost two Legions in the Battle of the Red Ring and the loss of the Eighth during the retreat from the Imperial City
3.) Is preparing to invade Valenwood and Elsweyr, and fight in a full fledged offensive war.
Yeah you guys are screwed.
And thats all you have Hope, What do the Sons and Daughters of Skyrim have:
Grit, Determination, Rage, Guerrilla Tactics, And arguably one of the most influential, and bad ass Leaders since Faolan and Tiber Septim leading their armies. One who speaks the Dragon Tongue
and isn't afraid to use it.
Or you can side with the Stormcloaks who are weaker than the Empire, can't even reach the Aldmeri Dominion, have cut the Empire in half near the brink of war and remove needed resources from reaching Cyrodiil.
Imperials will be fighting the elves. Stormcloaks have to rebuild their country, train their armies and hope they don't miss the war.
Alright:
1.) The Stormcloaks don't need training to fight Elves, maybe agile Khajiit and giant Bosmer Monsters but not Elves. Its practically in their blood.
2.) They'll have to unite Skyrim not rebuild it, The land war didn't completely destroy the land but rather separated it.
3.) An offensive war is much, MUCH harder to fight than a defensive one. You don't know the terrain, you have to get used to your environment, and not to mention the new debilitating diseases that can be transmitted onto your soldiers, especially since you're going to be fighting in a Jungle Environment. Ever heard of the Vietnam War. How did that turn out for the U.S. Soldiers?
4.) The Stormcloaks didn't "cut the empire in half" when they won the war. Skyrim was only good to the Empire in 2 ways:
Resources and Fighters
Now they can't get the Silver from the Reach, but like you said they don't need it, and they can't get Nords directly from Skyrim anymore as they'll be most likely ready to fight off the Dominion in a defensive war, (However that's not to say that their won't be able bodied Nords unwilling to fight for the Empire) And you still have The Orcs of Orsinium and of various Strongholds
5.) Trust me, the Stormcloaks wont miss it.
and by the way I'm not trying to be an asshole, but can you please fix your quote system? The way you quote things can be very confusing at times. It almost seems as if you're talking to yourself, and not quoting other people.
