Shoutbox Etiquette: Open Thread for Suggestions

[Rayven]

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http://skyrimforum.com/threads/emoticon-contest.23248/

 

[Gunnbjorn]

Gah, I just messed myself up. I'm going to take a nap.

Rest well

Still, I think the difference here is a matter of distinction: mediation versus moderation (in the forum management sense).

I can and have performed mediation here. I do not consider mediation to be up for discussion because generally it involves private matters and no discipline. This kind of falls in the "out of the kindness of my heart" realm because, strictly speaking, mediation is not in my official job description. I do it because I do think it helps the forum. But I do it because I'm Rayven and because someone invited me to help, not because I am a moderator.

A lot of people get "people attacking my point" and "people attacking my person" mixed up a lot, including myself just now I suggested my whole method to help distinguish that, but I'm sure you've dealt with that before so everything I've said was worthless, and I am thus taking a nap.

 

[Rayven]

A lot of people get "people attacking my point" and "people attacking my person" mixed up a lot, including myself just now I suggested my whole method to help distinguish that, but I'm sure you've dealt with that before so everything I've said was worthless, and I am thus taking a nap.

A lot of people do get those confused. That's very true. And I understand why you're making your suggestion. Nothing you've said is worthless. I find it a good exercise to "talk out loud" about these sorts of things precisely and exactly to help everyone get on the same page.

I want you guys to understand where I'm coming from and I warned straight off I'd play Devil's Advocate. I feel that the best way to encourage a positive culture is active communication. As Dale stated, agreeing to disagree is a huge part of that. Another huge part of it is making sure that we're all using common terms to describe our experience, especially since this forum is international in nature and so many of the words we use can have multiple meanings depending on your origin and cultural influence.

 

[Medea]

I agree with most things here. Some I don't.

Pornography, 18+ discussions, speaking to minors in a sexually suggestive way, etc...all of those should immediately be reported. (duh)

As far as discussion of one's personal life, I don't see how that's wrong. A lot of people use the SB or similar chat boxes in other forums to talk/get advice about their personal life. Sometimes they don't have anyone else to talk to and they trust or respect other forum members to give them the advice or consolation they are looking for. Now, if they are talking about how they "got it on" with their boyfriend or girlfriend last night in great detail, I can see how that would be offensive.

Politics. People confuse discussions about politics with attacking everyone that doesn't agree with them. I don't have any problem whatsoever with people debating politics in the SB, as long as it doesn't get so heated that personal attacks start being thrown around.

Gifs. I'm guilty of posting many weird gifs myself, but since the SB is now viewable in every area of the forum, it would be annoying if someone posted so many gifs that it slowed everyone's computer to a crawl. One or two gifs is enough.


Now there's something else I want to discuss about SB etiquette:

If you see something that "offends" you, please be sure to think before bothering Rayven about it. What is offensive to you might not be a big deal for 90% of people on the planet. People have different ideas about what is offensive and what isn't, and people have different ideas about what is humorous. If someone is making truly offensive remarks (personal attacks, racist/sexist remarks, etc) then they should be reported.

Just think to yourself, though: If this is something that someone can't really get in trouble for in any other kind of public forum, is it really worth reporting? If it's something minor and you don't think the moderator can actually do anything about it, for etiquette's sake it would be better if you just nicely asked the person to stop. Running to the mod every time you see something you don't like is poor etiquette too.

 

[Gunnbjorn]

I agree with most things here. Some I don't.

Pornography, 18+ discussions, speaking to minors in a sexually suggestive way, etc...all of those should immediately be reported. (duh)

Completely agreed.

I agree with most things here. Some I don't.
As far as discussion of one's personal life, I don't see how that's wrong. A lot of people use the SB or similar chat boxes in other forums to talk/get advice about their personal life. Sometimes they don't have anyone else to talk to and they trust or respect other forum members to give them the advice or consolation they are looking for. Now, if they are talking about how they "got it on" with their boyfriend or girlfriend last night in great detail, I can see how that would be offensive.

Agreed to an extent, talk about personal life like hobbies, what went on during your day, etc. However don't talk about very personal stuff in description, like the example you gave. I think advice is nice to ask in the shout box but not about very personal things. Later on in your post you tell us to be mindful of what we find to be annoying or offensive before bringing it to Rayven's attention, I think the same mindful approach should be asked to the people wanting to post in the shoutbox or ask for advice about personal things in their lives. I know there's a lot of helpful people, and I certainly like to advise and give guidance, but I also don't want the shoutbox to turn into one big therapy session, it's like the "hangout" of the forums. For everyone to chill and relax. Advice for things like "What game should I buy next?" or "What color Iphone should I get" is fine, but serious family issues and the like shouldn't be discussed to the public shoutbox, it gives a negative mood and some people just dont want to read that.
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[Epic Keith]

There should be a limit to the amount of a GIF and pics posted in the SB. Sometimes we get internet lags because of it

 

[Rayven]

There should be a limit to the amount of a GIF and pics posted in the SB. Sometimes we get internet lags because of it

I cannot "limit" the amount in the way most people are suggesting. The shoutbox allows me to either have images on (that's what it's set to now), links only (no images post at all, just a link to the image people can click on), or no links/images/anything.

I have actually turned it to "links only" for small periods of time when I feel my "suggestion" to tone it down hasn't been taken seriously.

If we want to be able to enjoy the option of images without it getting out of hand, it will have to be achieved through self-discipline.

 

[Rayven]

Now there's something else I want to discuss about SB etiquette:

If you see something that "offends" you, please be sure to think before bothering Rayven about it. What is offensive to you might not be a big deal for 90% of people on the planet. People have different ideas about what is offensive and what isn't, and people have different ideas about what is humorous. If someone is making truly offensive remarks (personal attacks, racist/sexist remarks, etc) then they should be reported.

Just think to yourself, though: If this is something that someone can't really get in trouble for in any other kind of public forum, is it really worth reporting? If it's something minor and you don't think the moderator can actually do anything about it, for etiquette's sake it would be better if you just nicely asked the person to stop. Running to the mod every time you see something you don't like is poor etiquette too.

I understand what you're saying here, and as a general forum citizen, I might agree. However, the flip side of this is that I will sometimes get a report and a PM about something that someone is just so incredibly angry about and has been tortured by for months and finally enough is enough. I can't help you if I don't know there's an issue.

As a mod, I say report it. Don't be a whiner and don't tell me how I should do my job. But tell me if something here makes you uncomfortable. Let me look at it. I'm not going to kiss your asses about what I see. But I will talk to you, figure out what you're looking for in a forum, and, if necessary, bid you all the best as you find another place to spend your internet time. Obviously, I'd like everyone to stay, have fun and get along. But we do have cases where the forum content is simply not compatible with someone's happiness. That's fine. Don't be here and be miserable.

I would rather over-reporting than under-reporting. I don't advertise who makes reports to anyone. I do find it disheartening when I get a report about someone feeling uncomfortable or harassed, but they didn't tell me for months because they didn't think it was <whatever>. It's ok for you to not take on the burden of deciding if something is worth reporting.

 

[Lady Imp]

I agree with most things here. Some I don't.

As far as discussion of one's personal life, I don't see how that's wrong. A lot of people use the SB or similar chat boxes in other forums to talk/get advice about their personal life. Sometimes they don't have anyone else to talk to and they trust or respect other forum members to give them the advice or consolation they are looking for. Now, if they are talking about how they "got it on" with their boyfriend or girlfriend last night in great detail, I can see how that would be offensive.

I couldn't agree with this more. The SB is a wonderful place to discuss personal issues. You get feedback from different people with different viewpoints, and a more broad and diverse group of people giving it. Putting it in a PM to me feels like cheerleaders in a locker room, all of whom are gonna agree with everything you say cause you're the captain, and not give any kind of useful ideas that you might not have come up with. But then again, personal issues and oversharing are two completely different things.

 

[Dagmar]

In the S.B no submitting underage girls/boys photos (It's creepy)

 

[Raijin]

In the S.B no submitting underage girls/boys photos (It's creepy)

ewwwwww that's child porn in the making.

 

[Dagmar]

There should be a limit to the amount of a GIF and pics posted in the SB. Sometimes we get internet lags because of it

You have other options. You can temporarily put posters on ignore. You can get a free adblock plugin for your browser and block the images. I do one or the other depending on the situation.

 

[rizen]

In general, I find the shoutbox is fine as it stands. I agree with previous things mentioned, sure, censorship - it could be argued over age limits and whether it is solely a parent's responsibility to monitor their child's viewing but lets not contribute to the corruption of young minds (even if it is fun).

As for people talking about their personal stuff: I suppose some people could be lurking over the shoutbox, more so, now that it can be viewed from wherever on the forums, just sitting there brooding over some tedious comments made eg. "Aw great, here's rizen again talking about picking his nose - nobody wants to hear that plops" and that's true, I'm sure a nostril dilemma isn't entertaining for some.
So, I'm not sure if this is an option, but previously when a member was 'ignored' this would not apply to seeing them in the shoutbox...if it is now, it'd simply be a matter of 'ignoring' that reoccurring offender, then no more bogeys show up on your radar.

If I had any gripes about the shoutbox, it'd be about the pictures (especially gifs) when it turns into some sort of competition over who can post the cutest of weirdest looking sloth or some plops, to the point of overload. Sends me into some serious lag on top of my 'tin cans and string' connection. Since that has already been addressed, I have nothing more to add.

The regulars in the shoutbox are clever, witty people that tend to enjoy some banter and discuss a whole range of stuff. Clever enough to know what will or wont have the cops knocking at our doors. We'll behave ourselves...promise
In closing, I plead 'not guilty' your honour.

 

[Raijin]

This maybe slight off-topic, Rayven but if theirs ever going to be a new moderator nomination I would want Dagmar or Docta Corvina (Maybe both?) to be nominated for the position.

Both of these ladies would make a fine addition to the SkyrimForums staffs. Both are level headed and are fair, base on what I've observed from the imperials vs Stormcloak thread and on the SB.

 

[Couthful]

SKYRIM FORUMS SHOUTBOX MAKES ME... smile

 

[Dagmar]

This maybe slight off-topic, Rayven but if theirs ever going to be a new moderator nomination I would want Dagmar or Docta Corvina (Maybe both?) to be nominated for the position.

I appreciate the thought but I'm not online as much these days. I also kind of got tired of moderating forums years ago which Rayven already knows. It is a responsibility that requires a measure of dedication which is why I appreciate what moderators do and am quick to jump down someone's throat when they are critical of moderator actions and decisions.

 

[Doctor Langstrom]

This maybe slight off-topic, Rayven but if theirs ever going to be a new moderator nomination I would want Dagmar or Docta Corvina (Maybe both?) to be nominated for the position.

Both of these ladies would make a fine addition to the SkyrimForums staffs. Both are level headed and are fair, base on what I've observed from the imperials vs Stormcloak thread and on the SB.

I seriously doubt the forum is going to need anymore. Skyrim is a dying game. Not a lot of new blood to be found.

 

[Lady Imp]

Another etiquette suggestion: all bacon must be shared with Anouck and I. In return, we share coffee and cookies.

 

[Gunnbjorn]

Another etiquette suggestion: all bacon must be shared with Anouck and I. In return, we share coffee and cookies.

 

[Anouck]

I think it is quite difficult to set rules for the shoutbox. And I'm not talking about 'no spamming' or 'no pornographic images' but rules regarding behavior. When people get offended that's based on interpretation. During religious or political debates there is always someone who ends up irritated because he/she feels disrespected. And often other people didn't intend to offend that person at all. And of course there are the obvious things like calling people 'an asshole', but it's usually not that easy.
Besides, it is a forum. People give their opinions and sometimes they can be very passionate about their personal convictions or beliefs. That is not an excuse to offend people but heated discussions and little conflicts are normal in my opinion. Things like that just happen. As long as it doesn't happen too often I don't see a problem.

The only thing I really have a problem with is something Raijin already said:

1. In the S.B no submitting underage girls/boys photos (It's creepy)

I won't say names but I noticed this too. Of course there is nothing wrong with some normal vacation photos but some underage members posted 'sexy' photos in order to get comments on it. And not the 'you have nice eyes' type of comments .
I also noticed some minors give pretty detailed descriptions of their sex life. I personally find that quite disturbing - but that could be just me.

As far as discussion of one's personal life, I don't see how that's wrong. A lot of people use the SB or similar chat boxes in other forums to talk/get advice about their personal life. Sometimes they don't have anyone else to talk to and they trust or respect other forum members to give them the advice or consolation they are looking for. Now, if they are talking about how they "got it on" with their boyfriend or girlfriend last night in great detail, I can see how that would be offensive.

I agree with Medea. That shoutbox conversations shouldn't turn into 'therapy sessions' is very true. But I don't think it's that bad. As far as I'm concerned the very personal debates are quite rare. Usually the sb is just a happy place with happy people and lots of rainbows and unicorns. The few times a member actually needs to vent and rage I am willing to listen. And it is not like those conversations take very long. After 30 minutes things usually get back to normal. And if I don't feel like listening to personal stories I just switch to another tab for a while.

That's just my 2 cents...

Another etiquette suggestion: all bacon must be shared with Anouck and I. In return, we share coffee and cookies.

IMP!

*plants flag*
now we can legally claim all their bacon.