Sex Negativity

I have had enough of the amount of mods on the nexus that are negative against women and change things about their appearance like boobs, arse etc. It makes us females look like a bunch of sluts. I find some of the mods on nexus that enhance women's boobs, etc are very sexist. It makes women ashamed of their bodies the way people change the bodies of women in mods to make them the 'perfect girl' also it causes men to look at women like they are objects rather than people.

I think some of these mods are just disgusting and are are simply discriminant against women. It's also the way men laugh at the girls bodies of these so called 'perfect girls' so how is it meant to make just normal girls feel? I know it's a game blah blah but is there any need for having to give women such a negative light? I also find some contents of these mods very offensive and so if men can look at some of these girls in game would they look at us the same in real life? Agrees/disagrees?

I have to admit I'm torn on the issue. There's a part of me that completely agrees. Come on guys, if women really looked like some of these mods, they would have to walk on all fours. They show so much skin that there's no possible way they would ever survive in battle. And no woman's boobs are that globular without a ton of plastic surgery.

On the other hand, it's not like there isn't plenty of burly, shirtless men floating around, either. I know that I have found ways to make males look attractive too, with enormous pecs and washboard abs...how is that any different? How is it any different when I fill my game with half-naked Nord men?

In the end, I guess it all depends on the person using the mods. The nice thing about fantasy RPGs is that they're just that - fantasy. It's all up to the user to make it their kind of fantasy. As long as they are able to identify the line drawn between that fantasy and reality, I don't see the harm in it.

I can see it. But you have to realize that more than a few of the modders for these types of mods are not women. They are dudes who wants something "hot" and this has been predominate in most fantasy and Science Fiction productions. I don't think they are trying to make anyone feel "ashamed." And these technically aren't discriminatory as they are mods and aren't required to enjoy the game. Do they prevent you from enjoying the game? or just your searches for mods?

I don't feel what you are looking at is a negative portrayal of women. But a misguided portrayal. I don't think they are meant for you to feel anything, and are mostly for some introverted dudes to feel something in the nether regions. Case and point is I do not like or use mods like that. Because for me they don't do anything for me.

A point of order: the assumption that all of these mods are the work of males is false. I have run across quite a number of 'skimpy armor' mods and such that were the work of women (or at least of user profiles that identify as women; gender is such a murky subject on the internet). Oh, sure, I doubt any of the mods over at Lover's Lab (don't go there, seriously) are the work of either women or well-adjusted men, but on the Nexus, there's a large number of female modders who are fully participant in the whole 'make Skyrim cartoonishly sexy' thing.

Frankly, while I don't necessarily endorse any such mods, you can't quite hold them to the standards of official products. They are created by private users, are entirely optional, and confined to certain sections of certain sites (Nexus allows one to completely exclude adult-oriented mods from searches or browsing). No matter what your hot-button topic is, you will always find mods that are offensive to your sensibilities, be it sexual objectification or child-killing or turning giant spiders into bears.

The real issue isn't that these mods exist, it's that they are so popular. But there are a number of different issues tied into that, and I don't have time to get into it so I'm gonna stop rambling here.

The argument that because some of these mods are made by woman makes them less offensive is flawed, as (at least in my opinion/ understanding) you can be sexist to your own gender. For example, a woman from the 1800's would say woman belong at home and not at work, as they have been raised to not think beyond such.
Still, I understand the upset around these mods and yet don't completely object them. More-so, the way they portray themselves (such as "improved", argh) -

Lady Imp said:

In the end, I guess it all depends on the person using the mods. The nice thing about fantasy RPGs is that they're just that - fantasy. It's all up to the user to make it their kind of fantasy. As long as they are able to identify the line drawn between that fantasy and reality, I don't see the harm in it.

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This encompasses it for me .

I do wish that Skyrim would have allowed more when the part came up to determine our character. I absolutely hate how they put in a "push-up" style appearance on the female's. But then, I'm a charter member of the "itty-bitty-titty committee". Either that or more clothing/armor options.

As far as what she wears is Enchanted Forsworn armor, ring, necklace, Vampire Gauntlets and Vampire Boots. Although I cannot stand the top (I rather like the tops of what some of the female bandit's wear). True in that realistically, she'd be very scarred or injured in fights with what little she has on (I have her fashioned after Saxa).

Too bad I play on XBox, or I'd make some adjustments.

The skimpy, slutty mods aren't the only things we have to worry about. There's a mod out there that has every woman in the game in a dungeon and being tortured. That's some MESSED UP STUFF right there! Who the Hell comes up with it?! And how dare is that pig still allowed to make mods!?

Lifts-Her-Tail

I really start hated several mod makers in oblivion. Their armours where very good BUT
Size of certain things would break spine of real woman. Sadly some makers even now continue same thing in Skyrim.

Torok said:

The skimpy, slutty mods aren't the only things we have to worry about. There's a mod out there that has every woman in the game in a dungeon and being tortured. That's some MESSED UP STUFF right there! Who the Hell comes up with it?! And how dare is that pig still allowed to make mods!?

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Evil Lair of Hydra? that's nothing there are far worse then that look up a mod called Estrus for Skyrim actually it might be best you don't look it up but if you do don't say I didn't warn you it takes a lot to disgust me and that one disgusts me infact im surprised it has not been removed from the Skyrim nexus

I think what Lifts is really saying, and she makes a valid point, is that it's a little disheartening when a lot of male modders create females in the way that they do. They are essentially showing us what their ideal woman is, all be it an unrealistic portrayal of the REAL female body. It's the same with magazines and such who shove size two models in our faces every other day.
Women have a lot of expectations to live up to, and if men add to those expectations by creating a female form that is so unobtainable, then they feel a let down and dejected. It's a fact that women are sensitive to these things. She wants to know that her man loves her, just the way she is, not secretly adding cup sizes to her boobs and more junk in her trunk.
I'm not saying that men don't feel the same way, but ladies are a little more sensitive about it. Will that stop them from making these hideous representations of us? No, because it is their right to do so, and so it is a woman's right to be annoyed with it.

I agree overall, but understand that modders are free. You don't have to support them nor download their mod.
In retrospect, do you think guys feel less as a man to see all of these muscle bound men in vanilla game? Even more so with body builder body type mods? Hell, there is even SLONGS OF SKYRIM!

I say become a modder yourself and make awesome female mods =] -- It's hard to find companion mods with outstanding female design that isn't completely irritating to deal with x.x
I will be making my own in the future (hopefully).

(Please note I do realize the overbearing LARGE number of the mods you're talking about, but that just means the over bearing amount of modders who think like that or want that kinda thing.)

http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/10111/?

Sorry if this is even more offensive... but well theres this if you don't like the other stuff, just a thought...

shadowkitty said:

I think what Lifts is really saying, and she makes a valid point, is that it's a little disheartening when a lot of male modders create females in the way that they do. They are essentially showing us what their ideal woman is, all be it an unrealistic portrayal of the REAL female body. It's the same with magazines and such who shove size two models in our faces every other day.
Women have a lot of expectations to live up to, and if men add to those expectations by creating a female form that is so unobtainable, then they feel a let down and dejected. It's a fact that women are sensitive to these things. She wants to know that her man loves her, just the way she is, not secretly adding cup sizes to her boobs and more junk in her trunk.
I'm not saying that men don't feel the same way, but ladies are a little more sensitive about it. Will that stop them from making these hideous representations of us? No, because it is their right to do so, and so it is a woman's right to be annoyed with it.

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Call me insensitive, but my response to this is to grow a thicker skin. The only person who can control the pressure is you. There's such a huge deal made over how images make women feel, how about you change how you feel about it? Is it really that difficult to say "yup, that plops's photoshopped and it's fake and you know what, I'm killer because I'm 100% natural bitches yeaaaaah!!"? And besides, why is it we feel the need to base our self-worth on how others think of us? Why the hell does it matter if a guy is adding junk in my trunk in his mind? Those guys are so not worth the time, and with any amount of luck if more women turn off the emotional waterworks and stop mating with assholes like that, then they'll discontinue passing on their genetic makeup and cease to exist. I feel that part of the problem is that we validate their actions by whining about it. Stop validating the actions, realise that your self-esteem is based on how YOU think about yourself, not how others do, and with any amount of luck this will stop.

*retreats back into her bitch cave*

zane said:

I agree overall, but understand that modders are free. You don't have to support them nor download their mod.
In retrospect, do you think guys feel less as a man to see all of these muscle bound men in vanilla game? Even more so with body builder body type mods? Hell, there is even SLONGS OF SKYRIM!

I say become a modder yourself and make awesome female mods =] -- It's hard to find companion mods with outstanding female design that isn't completely irritating to deal with x.x
I will be making my own in the future (hopefully).

(Please note I do realize the overbearing LARGE number of the mods you're talking about, but that just means the over bearing amount of modders who think like that or want that kinda thing.)

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you do have a valid point there. are people they forgetting their are male body mods as well as female ones? many of the female body mods i have seen on the nexus were created by women NOT men and odds are the male body replaces were NOT made by men either i am not to sure about thatone but ask yourself dont you think that can make numerous men who plays Skyrim feel insecure about their appearance aswell?

Lady Imp said:

Call me insensitive, but my response to this is to grow a thicker skin. The only person who can control the pressure is you. There's such a huge deal made over how images make women feel, how about you change how you feel about it? Is it really that difficult to say "yup, that pl***'s photoshopped and it's fake and you know what, I'm killer because I'm 100% natural bitches yeaaaaah!!"? And besides, why is it we feel the need to base our self-worth on how others think of us? Why the hell does it matter if a guy is adding junk in my trunk in his mind? Those guys are so not worth the time, and with any amount of luck if more women turn off the emotional waterworks and stop mating with assholes like that, then they'll discontinue passing on their genetic makeup and cease to exist. I feel that part of the problem is that we validate their actions by whining about it. Stop validating the actions, realise that your self-esteem is based on how YOU think about yourself, not how others do, and with any amount of luck this will stop.

*retreats back into her bitch cave*

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*sends a cabana boy and a margarita machine to Imp's cave for being able to better articulate my pov then I can*

Lady Imp said:

shadowkitty said:

I think what Lifts is really saying, and she makes a valid point, is that it's a little disheartening when a lot of male modders create females in the way that they do. They are essentially showing us what their ideal woman is, all be it an unrealistic portrayal of the REAL female body. It's the same with magazines and such who shove size two models in our faces every other day.
Women have a lot of expectations to live up to, and if men add to those expectations by creating a female form that is so unobtainable, then they feel a let down and dejected. It's a fact that women are sensitive to these things. She wants to know that her man loves her, just the way she is, not secretly adding cup sizes to her boobs and more junk in her trunk.
I'm not saying that men don't feel the same way, but ladies are a little more sensitive about it. Will that stop them from making these hideous representations of us? No, because it is their right to do so, and so it is a woman's right to be annoyed with it.

Click to expand...

Call me insensitive, but my response to this is to grow a thicker skin. The only person who can control the pressure is you. There's such a huge deal made over how images make women feel, how about you change how you feel about it? Is it really that difficult to say "yup, that pl***'s photoshopped and it's fake and you know what, I'm killer because I'm 100% natural bitches yeaaaaah!!"? And besides, why is it we feel the need to base our self-worth on how others think of us? Why the hell does it matter if a guy is adding junk in my trunk in his mind? Those guys are so not worth the time, and with any amount of luck if more women turn off the emotional waterworks and stop mating with assholes like that, then they'll discontinue passing on their genetic makeup and cease to exist. I feel that part of the problem is that we validate their actions by whining about it. Stop validating the actions, realise that your self-esteem is based on how YOU think about yourself, not how others do, and with any amount of luck this will stop.

*retreats back into her bitch cave*

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Oh I couldn't agree with you more Imp, because that is how I feel. But some women aren't as self appreciative as women like you and I, it's sad, but true. I would love every woman out there to have such a positive attitude about herself, and there needs to be more education about the whole thing. I feel for them, but like you said, some women need to grow a set and learn to love themselves for who they are and not take it personally. Well said Imp

tx12001 said:

zane said:

I agree overall, but understand that modders are free. You don't have to support them nor download their mod.
In retrospect, do you think guys feel less as a man to see all of these muscle bound men in vanilla game? Even more so with body builder body type mods? Hell, there is even SLONGS OF SKYRIM!

I say become a modder yourself and make awesome female mods =] -- It's hard to find companion mods with outstanding female design that isn't completely irritating to deal with x.x
I will be making my own in the future (hopefully).

(Please note I do realize the overbearing LARGE number of the mods you're talking about, but that just means the over bearing amount of modders who think like that or want that kinda thing.)

Click to expand...

you do have a valid point there. are people they forgetting their are male body mods as well as female ones? many of the female body mods i have seen on the nexus were created by women NOT men and odds are the male body replaces were NOT made by men either i am not to sure about thatone but ask yourself dont you think that can make numerous men who plays Skyrim feel insecure about their appearance aswell?

Click to expand...

Hands all the sensitive men a box of tissues to stuff their padded bras with...

I have to agree with the OP as well on this issue but for a different reason. It's such a pain to try to find good armor for my female characters but cannot because Sir Dip **** thinks Iron Armor is two straps covering a woman's private parts and a thong. Why can't I get legitimate armor that is not sexualized but still indicates a female feel to it?

While I hate to use a different game as a example, I actually feel like Halo (Yes, Halo) did a good job with "Female Armor".


It looks awesome, shows that a female resides inside the armor but is not sexualized! I have yet to find a mod that replicates the same idea that Bungie did with it's series regarding the opposite sex in regards to fantasy/science fiction. Has anyone else seen a mod on Skyrim that can pull this off?

Mannulus said:

I have to agree with the OP as well on this issue but for a different reason. It's such a pain to try to find good armor for my female characters but cannot because Sir Dip **** thinks Iron Armor is two straps covering a woman's private parts and a thong. Why can't I get legitimate armor that is not sexualized but still indicates a female feel to it?

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This does kind of grind my gears a little, mostly because I honestly don't understand how an iron display off a Victoria's Secret mannequin can provide any sort of protection. If anything, nipples will freeze off. We're in Skyrim here folks, not the Summerset Isles. I can't put my characters in any of that stuff without thinking that her mammary glands will fall off on the side of the road somewhere in the Pale due to frostbite.

shadowkitty said:

Hands all the sensitive men a box of tissues to stuff their padded bras with...

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I doubt many of us guys actually do worry about this stuff, but I mean, if females have the right to so should we. Remember that "gender equality" thing women fought for for years?