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JClarke1953

Well-Known Member
I began another char some day's ago, and have her at level 32. Thing is, while I was playing, I began to wonder exactly what is the point? No matter what I do, or how I work my character, there's no "end".

After the War, nothing is fixed, nothing is better. It's like it never happened. Even more, the leader's on both sides want the Dragonborn to kill the remaining opposition after the War is, umm, "over". Yet things remain the same.

After Alduin is killed, nothing much else happens. We all know the consequences of killing or not killing Paarthurnax. Yet, not much else changes, or happens. The same with the Dark Brotherhood, Thieves Guild, Companions, Vampire Lord or any other group or faction, after it's all said and done, the Dragonborn is still an "errand-boy".

Even on Solstheim, after Mirrak and a few other potential "calamities", well, that's it. The rest is just, well, amassing one's fortune in Coin.

There's no Endgame. No accolade's, no subjection of the citizen's, no good or evil Dragonborn. No matter what I or you wish to have your character be, in the end, well, there is none. Nothing much changes or happens no matter how one has their Dragonborn whether a Vampire, Lycan or whatever, there is not much of anything but knowing Bethesda left us, and the Dragonborn out in, well, "Oblivion" so to speak.
 

Irishman

Well-Endowed Member
That is the exact reason why I dont finish questlines anymore (or very rarely anyway). Its too difficult Rp wise to be a Harbinger/Arch-mage/Listener/Guild Master etc and still be doing all the little errands that by rights, YOU should be assigning to people.

As you mentioned, nothing really changes and we know that, therefore unless you really want the end reward (eg. amulet of articulation/arch-mage robes...) than I see no point in becoming the leader of the faction... and certainly not the leader of multiple factions...
 

Hildolfr

It's a big hammer.
I think it's up to the individual player to decide when a character's game has ended. If the character has stopped the dragon menace, lead the Companions to glory, defeated Miraak, prevented the vampiric entities from completing their plans, and has overall done everything they wish to do in the world... then perhaps it's time to retire to the countryside.

In real world terms, when you get that feeling of, "Why am I bothering with this?", it may be a good idea to step away from Skyrim for awhile. I've had it happen with many a game where I'll be playing vigorously and then one day I'll start to play and it hits me. I just don't see the point. So, I stop and either play something else, read a book, do another hobby, or whatever the case is. Sometimes those feelings can last for weeks, other times just for days.

I guess it kind of boils down to that Skyrim isn't big on consequences, but it is pretty big on choice.
 

sticky runes

Well-Known Member
I think this is why so many of us have that constant restart problem - there are a lot of rewards to beginning a new character, choosing which factions to join, which skills to specialize in, which NPCs to make friends with, and the early stages are all very exciting, but where does it end? It doesn't. We can start a new character, but we can never really finish him or her, we just lose interest in them and start a new one and go through the same process only making slightly different decisions.
 

JClarke1953

Well-Known Member
Also, mind you, I'm not complaining, I think we long term player's pretty much know all of what I posted anyway. After all, what would be wrong with some kind of end, or alternatives based on the direction of the Dragonborn (such as in Assassin?). Then the interest and fun to see what happens with any changes that you'd make.

It just really bums me out. The char I have is doing really well with a Blades Sword and a Soul taking Fine Steel knife. Only thing's I've grinded up are Conjuring (to use two Atronach's) a bit of Alchemy and Enchant. I've yet to decide if I want to do the Alchemy/Enchant exploit. It's the only decent one as far as we XBox user's can get I think.

Hell, fought a Frosty yesterday and Lydia came up missing. I figured the Dragon had gotten hold of her or something. But I never found her body. Yet she shows up at the last Dungeon for the Gaulder Amulet (whoopee!). And my char has used nothing but her sword and knife. But I guess I'd better work on Destruction....I guess.
 

sticky runes

Well-Known Member
What kills it for me is the never ending list of quests. I've always felt there should be a deletion option, or at least a folder where I can store quests I don't want to do. It's one thing having a never ending game, but a list of things to do that just keeps getting more and more cluttered, even with quests that I have finished, just kills the game's sense of accomplishment even more.
 

Atz

Member
What kills it for me is the never ending list of quests. I've always felt there should be a deletion option, are at least a folder where I can store quests I don't want to do. It's one thing having a never ending game, but a list of things to do that just keeps getting more and more cluttered, even with quests that I have finished, just kills the game's sense of accomplishment even more.

Yea Sticky --- That's one thing I really wish Bethesda had givin players , an option to do a Quest or not . Example ( That Idiot who patrols the area right in front of your house in Solitude , EVER complaning about his "Master " went on Vacation ( GRRRRRR ) I hate that stupid Quest ( Wabberjack thing so much ) so I'm stuck with his presence Forever ... No choice you have to do the quest to get him out of the game . And I could go on and on ....But enough venting ...:rolleyes:
 

raido KASAI

Ansei Master Badass
It doesn't give you a start either except knowing you are being carted off to die. So it's by design that it's open-ended. It's a bit easier to keep going on PC than on consoles due to the ever increasing amounts and quality of mods adding new locations and new quests.

One thing I do that keeps interest in my main is that I attempt to tie my alternate character back-stories in some way to my main character. It might be a chance acquaintance or something longer term. It also helps in that I used the CK to add my main character as an NPC in subsequent play-throughs
 

Blackdoom59

BATMAN!
Pretty much the reason none of my characters make it past level 20. Usually if I finish a quest line with one character I just make a new one, instead of having my previous guy get WAY to strong. Some people like to have one Alduin-slaying, emperor-murdering, sweetroll-stealing, Aela-banging, fireball-throwing, vampire-killing, Miraak-overthrowing, Daedric-Worshipping, Land-owning, Kid-feeding, War-winning, Jarl-pleasing, skeever-exterminating, bandit-beating, undead-raising, draggr-chopping, giant-bashing, dragon-taming overpowered character that visits the cloud district very often. Other people(like me) like multiple characters, each with their own strengths and weaknesses.
 

Perkless in Skyrim

Bad to the Dragonbone.
I agree with much of this because I'm a serial re-starter. But just as we make our own "house rules" to increase the challenge and/or make things more interesting, so we can also set an End Goal for our characters.
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
Skyrim is a great game, but it's targeted towards the casual gamers. You can do everything on one character, no problems. Get all the cool things easily and what not.

If you want the consequences and the way you're seen by your actions, Morrowind and Oblivion are the direction you're looking for. You can't do everything in Morrowind in one character, you need several if I recall correctly because certain factions hate each other. Also you need high skills in what the faction favors to advance in rank.

When it comes to Skyrim, instead of complaining why you have to do this and this and why you can be this so easily. You can restrict yourself, make the faction line last a lot longer, until you level up and what not. Skyrim is action and elements of RPG, but majority of what makes the game is what you can imagine.

My advice, don't wait for the game to suddenly change. Use your imagination, take your time and restrict yourself. If you hate being Arch-Mage while only being a novice in Magic, then don't speed run the faction quest. If you hate being an errand boy, stop accepting the errands. Go slay some giant, or build your manor, do what you want to do. Instead of what the NPC's want you to do.

Just because you're the Dragonborn doesn't mean every NPC should give a plops. Same in Oblivion, I helped save all Tamriel and defended the people of Cyrodiil. I'd still get some people calling me a bastard and other insults, cause they didn't like me.
 

Hildolfr

It's a big hammer.
When it comes to Skyrim, instead of complaining why you have to do this and this and why you can be this so easily. You can restrict yourself, make the faction line last a lot longer, until you level up and what not. Skyrim is action and elements of RPG, but majority of what makes the game is what you can imagine.

My advice, don't wait for the game to suddenly change. Use your imagination, take your time and restrict yourself. If you hate being Arch-Mage while only being a novice in Magic, then don't speed run the faction quest. If you hate being an errand boy, stop accepting the errands. Go slay some giant, or build your manor, do what you want to do. Instead of what the NPC's want you to do.

This.

I did this once with an Imperial character. The goal for the character was to join the Legion and end the war with the Stormcloaks. I really took my time with the Civil War timeline and did other stuff to stretch it out with the logic that whatever I was doing would further the Imperial agenda or help the Legion or whatever. In the end, I was Thane of Solitude, defeated the Stormcloaks, and had reached like, level 35 or something. I don't think I joined any of the guilds just because I couldn't rationalize their usefulness to my warrior. Though I may have joined the Dawnguard because the vampires were hurting the war effort and I definitely did the main quest because you can't have peace in Skyrim with dragons trying to kill everyone.

Anyway, my point is, making end goals for your character and stretching out the questlines is a great way to keep a character relevant and believable than if you rush through things. But then again, you have to be willing to have multiple characters.
 

Gigapact

Lollygagging Milk Drinker (according to guards)
I began another char some day's ago, and have her at level 32. Thing is, while I was playing, I began to wonder exactly what is the point? No matter what I do, or how I work my character, there's no "end".


I agree with you. Although, I do think some things they did on purpose so you could use more imagination. While that's great and fun, I think it lacks consequence and end results like you said.

While I do not mind there being no real end (because in real life, it ends once you die for good), there need to be end results to things.

For example: College of Winterhold. I am now archemage.... and I'm still running boy errands? I think it would be cool and make more sense if you could walk up to your fellow mages and give them tasks to do. Or maybe if they walked up for some advice once and a while. Or if your skill is high enough, they could come to you for training. Etc etc etc.

The other funny thing to that is the fact that you can become archemage with potentially zero skills in magic. My first character ever I was just doing all the quests, and he was one handed and shield with absolutely no magic ability. He became archemage. I think at the end of the main quest, Tolfdir should step up. He should tell you that he does not think you are ready to have such a high responsibility so he will watch over the college until you craft your skills better. Now, it's your job to get two or three schools of magic up to 70 or 80 skill level. That makes more sense to me....

Dark Brotherhood: I think they did this one a little better, because they actually encourage you to slaughter people any way you like, so that part doesn't matter. Also, at the end, you have the DB initiates that you can command. You are also in charge of the Night Mother quests, as should be. The only thing here I guess is providing tasks yourself to Nazir and Babbette. But I didn't mind the end results of this one, although I do think the Thieves Guild should recognize your position as Listener and use this to their advantage, since they work with the DB afterall. There could be a quest where TG needs you and the DB to commit a few assassinations or something.

TG: Kind of the same thing with the College.

The War: Yeah... I guess Whiterun gets to be in destruction for the rest of the game as well as a few other things. I wish after the war, there could be another major questline focused on cleaning up the aftermath.

Well, anyways! I agree with you.
 

JClarke1953

Well-Known Member
While I was doing searches to help other people, I found the Dark Brotherhood had Elsif on their list. Thing is, it was never put into the game itself.

I'm kind of like you with the Archmage thing. My char had been mainly a Blade Sword and a "fine" steel Soul taking dagger. At level 32, she still is.

I think many of us have done the Vampire Lord thing, been "in charge" of the DB, Thieves Guild, Companion's and whatever. Yet when it's all said and done, there's no "evil" Dovakin "ruler", no "good" one, or one that more or less kind of "retires", perhaps up to High Hrothgar, or if Par is killed, then perhaps somewhere with the Blades.

Like the thing with Saadia and the Redguard. There's no consequence for luring her to the stable, collecting the reward, then killing the Redguard, calming her to get her money before she attacks. If the Redguard wanted her so much, what happened?

Granted, the choices are varied in many ways of what we can choose or not. It's just that nothing really happens. And nothing really ends. You help win the War? People still complain of it. Alduin? Nothing is said or done at all when he is killed.

Harkon? You accept his gift, you end being an errand boy/girl. You don't and you run errands for the Dawnguard. What about Auriel's Bow? The eye-candy when it's treated with blood or not is great. But what then? You're a Vamp Lord with a Bow to darken the sun. So what?

Immersion in a game is great. But immersion without consequences, or some kind of end-play?

Yeh, I know I'm armchair-quarterbacking Skyrim. And I'm kind of having fun with my new char. It just bums me out that when I've done all I can do with her, well, that's it. There's nothing.
 

Irishman

Well-Endowed Member
What about Auriel's Bow? The eye-candy when it's treated with blood or not is great. But what then? You're a Vamp Lord with a Bow to darken the sun. So what?

So... what :eek:

I walk as a God among mortals when the sun no longer affects my undead skin. Fearless warriors wet themselves when I pass them with Serana by my side, two thralled Volkihors, a Sanguine Dremora Lord and a Death hound. As I turn to stare them down atop my immortal steed, Shadowmare, there is no1 who averts thier gaze and pays homage to my power that rivals the great Molag Bal himself!

:p hehe some1 say imagination?
 

tx12001

I will not tolerate failure...
That is the exact reason why I dont finish questlines anymore (or very rarely anyway). Its too difficult Rp wise to be a Harbinger/Arch-mage/Listener/Guild Master etc and still be doing all the little errands that by rights, YOU should be assigning to people.

As you mentioned, nothing really changes and we know that, therefore unless you really want the end reward (eg. amulet of articulation/arch-mage robes...) than I see no point in becoming the leader of the faction... and certainly not the leader of multiple factions...
I prefer to become the leader of only 1 faction 2 at most and only if it is a similar type of faction such as being the leader of the volkihar and joining the DB for instance as they could coexist (probably) but I usually reserve joining the Volkihar as something more late game as many of the things you do in the earlier parts would not really make logical sense, for instance up until I got a mod that allowed me to advance through the companions without becoming a werewolf. I would only do the companions questline BEFORE joining the Volkihar and I would do the thieves guild quest before becoming a Vampire aswell as a lot of things in that questline would not make sense either like the deal with nocturnal considering that as a vampire you are immortal or Karliah shooting a POISONED arrow at you to stop your heartbeat as she foolishly believes Mercer Frey could defeat you so you dont blead out despite the fact that your a vampire who are immune to poison and probably don't not even have a heartbeat since your technically the walking dead now for RP purposes however I become a Vampire to become immortal and thus avoid the deals that my Character made with the Daedra also on a sidenote why do some think Azura is all seeing if she was all seeing why did she not foresee me stealing her artifact and desecrating it by unbinding it from her
 

The Honorable Gidian Diva of Sass

Sahrot Vahlok Spaan. Bahnahgaar. Minion #88!
Staff member
That is the exact reason why I dont finish questlines anymore (or very rarely anyway). Its too difficult Rp wise to be a Harbinger/Arch-mage/Listener/Guild Master etc and still be doing all the little errands that by rights, YOU should be assigning to people.

As you mentioned, nothing really changes and we know that, therefore unless you really want the end reward (eg. amulet of articulation/arch-mage robes...) than I see no point in becoming the leader of the faction... and certainly not the leader of multiple factions...
I prefer to become the leader of only 1 faction 2 at most and only if it is a similar type of faction such as being the leader of the volkihar and joining the DB for instance as they could coexist (probably) but I usually reserve joining the Volkihar as something more late game as many of the things you do in the earlier parts would not really make logical sense, for instance up until I got a mod that allowed me to advance through the companions without becoming a werewolf. I would only do the companions questline BEFORE joining the Volkihar and I would do the thieves guild quest before becoming a Vampire aswell as a lot of things in that questline would not make sense either like the deal with nocturnal considering that as a vampire you are immortal or Karliah shooting a POISONED arrow at you to stop your heartbeat as she foolishly believes Mercer Frey could defeat you so you dont blead out despite the fact that your a vampire who are immune to poison and probably don't not even have a heartbeat since your technically the walking dead now for RP purposes however I become a Vampire to become immortal and thus avoid the deals that my Character made with the Daedra also on a sidenote why do some think Azura is all seeing if she was all seeing why did she not foresee me stealing her artifact and desecrating it by unbinding it from her
That part with the poison arrow is probably the single most annoying part of Skyrim
It makes me want to backhand Karliah, and say, "BIT**! I'M THE FU**ING DRAGONBORN! I DON'T NEED YOUR HELP!" It really pi**ed me off that they forced you into that situation. There are honestly too many situations you are forced into in a game that so heavily revolves around choice that it completely leaves out consequence.
 
I agree that there is "end" to skyrim. One thing that I have done is make the ending to my characters. Whether this is finishing a questline, moving to the countryside, or my character dying on the battlefield.
In my opinion when it comes to role playing in skyrim this no ending to skyrim is great.
 

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