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Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
What does one do with all those evil/negative quests that you end up with in your journal that there is no way your "Good" character would ever do (i.e. Bothia, Molag Bol, Namia, etc...)? Do you just ignore them?

I've been doing that on my most recent character, Ms. Good-Two-Shoes Imperial and concentrating on just doing the helpful ones and the ones where you can eliminate all kinds of baddies (bandits, foreswarn, draugers, dragons, etc...). Obviously she is going to avoid the TG all together but help all the other folks in Riften (does anyone know if there's a way to bring the TG down? - she would do that) and to destroy the Dark Brotherhood, but there are so many ethically questionable quests out there.

Any thoughts?

(Of course this is as opposed to my utterly evil Dunmer who I'm basing strongly on Asajj Ventris from the Star Wars series, right down to her appearance and weapons choices - Asajj is just plain nasty, although she'll sometimes do something helpful if it furthers her agenda).
 
Olsthepols

Olsthepols

Fus Ro Dah
There is a way to destroy the dark brotherhood. When Astrid is in that abandoned house with you and she asks you to kill one of the three prisoners you can kill her and it will start a new quest called destroy the Dark Brotherhood.
 
Remington721

Remington721

Member
Yea good subject . The Bothia quest is far over the edge for me . I just went and Killed them all . Now I have to forever look at this in my quest log . And the other was the cannibel quest in Markarth , I go in to the Hall of the dead and waste her . I have never liked the D.B. Quest , so now I just do away with them , but the Thieves Guild I'm not really sure??? I tried to kill "Vekel the Man" ( who owns the Ragged Flagon and is the bartender ) And he's one of those in game " sleeper" kind of character's ..... He can't be killed on console X-Box , he is a tough deadly" BLEEP " and I ended up running clear out of Riften to save my life :cowboy:
 
Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
Olsthepols said:
There is a way to destroy the dark brotherhood. When Astrid is in that abandoned house with you and she asks you to kill one of the three prisoners you can kill her and it will start a new quest called destroy the Dark Brotherhood.
Click to expand...
That one I knew and intend to do, I was wondering about the TG.
 
Olsthepols

Olsthepols

Fus Ro Dah
You dont have to do the Thieves Guild quest and also the TG aren't actually evil especially the Nightingales
 
Olsthepols

Olsthepols

Fus Ro Dah
You dont have to do the Thieves Guild quest and also the TG aren't actually evil especially the Nightingales
 
Olsthepols

Olsthepols

Fus Ro Dah
You dont have to do the Thieves Guild quest and also the TG aren't actually evil especially the Nightingales
 
Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
Olsthepols said:
You dont have to do the Thieves Guild quest and also the TG aren't actually evil especially the Nightingales
Click to expand...
True, but it involves thievery which my character would consider wrong, if not evil. She would want to end the guild. Obviously she is not going to do the TG quests. And why would Nightingales not be considered evil? It's not like Nocturnal is a good Daedra.
 
Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
Olsthepols said:
Because you meet a nightingale in the game and she's not evil, she believes in good things
Click to expand...
FAH! She's still a thief. Just 'cause one isn't as bad as the others doesn't make the Nightingale's all that much better. than any other. Still bad, maybe not evil, but definately not good.
 
Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
A thought on the DB. There really is no reason to even talk to Aventus at all other than to clear it off the journal. Greold, maybe, since my character does like children, but, still, it would be the murder of a relative innocent. So Astrid keeps sending assassins. So what? It's not like they have any chance of succeeding. They never actually sneak up on you, you can see 'em a mile away and stripping them is usually profitable (although it pisses me off that you can't take that dern armor from them and leave 'em laying there naked in the road).
 
Olsthepols

Olsthepols

Fus Ro Dah
The Dark Brotherhood would keep on killing people for a long time. If the murder of one old woman who makes children live horrible lives means no more Dark Brotherhood then I think its worth it.
 
Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
Olsthepols said:
The Dark Brotherhood would keep on killing people for a long time. If the murder of one old woman who makes children live horrible lives means no more Dark Brotherhood then I think its worth it.
Click to expand...
True, true, but I guess I'm not sure on my characters total moral makeup. Do the ends justify the means or is she more concerned with the means. The TG will keep on stealing stuff that people worked hard to get (I know, not always, but still) whether I do anything with them or not, so, what difference does a few murders make, especially since I'm murdering hundreds of bandits, foreswarn, mages and Stormcloaks on a regular basis but justifying it as "they are bad guys" or in the cause of the war.

It gets really murky. Besides, how do we really know their lives are that horrible? Because they say so? At least they're housed, clothed and fed, which is more than I can say for my little Lucia before she met me and any number of other street kids I met during the course of the game. A little slave labor makes them earn their keep. Besides, if she was that bad then the authorities would have done something, right? Maven may be a not nice person, but I can't see, even her putting up with the abuse of children. Where's the profit in that?
 
sticky runes

sticky runes

Well-Known Member
It f#cks me right off that all these evil quests get forced into your journal, and there is no way to delete them. It's like the game is saying "Your do-gooder paladin character has not chosen a sacrificial victim for Boethia yet" - that's because I don't f#cking want to do that quest.

And the game kinda does push you into joining the thieves guild. At the point where you have to track down Esbern, you're pretty much instructed to find Brynjolf and carry out his pickpocket quest so he'll give you info about the cisterns or whatever. And those stones of Barenziah - the ONLY person in all of Skyrim who is able to identify them is a member of the thieves' guild, which sucks. Plus there's those journals that Vekel asks you to gather - I collected them all before I even met the man because I had gone to that dungeon for another quest, and it shows up in my quest journal that I need to take them back to a character I've never met.
 
Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
sticky runes said:
It f#cks me right off that all these evil quests get forced into your journal, and there is no way to delete them. It's like the game is saying "Your do-gooder paladin character has not chosen a sacrificial victim for Boethia yet" - that's because I don't f#cking want to do that quest.

And the game kinda does push you into joining the thieves guild. At the point where you have to track down Esbern, you're pretty much instructed to find Brynjolf and carry out his pickpocket quest so he'll give you info about the cisterns or whatever. And those stones of Barenziah - the ONLY person in all of Skyrim who is able to identify them is a member of the thieves' guild, which sucks. Plus there's those journals that Vekel asks you to gather - I collected them all before I even met the man because I had gone to that dungeon for another quest, and it shows up in my quest journal that I need to take them back to a character I've never met.
Click to expand...
Agree with all of that. Fortunately, with Esbern and the Journals all I need to do is get to the ragged flaggon and 1) head in to the catacombs and 2) give Esbern the journals (of course I usually just keep them like I keep all journals - I have a whole shelf of them at home and sometimes like to reread them).
 
LotusEater

LotusEater

I brake for blue butterflies
Why bother trying to take down the Thieve's Guild? They are already crap when you join. It's up to you to bring them back. So just ignore them and allow Frey to continue running them into the ground.
 
Olsthepols

Olsthepols

Fus Ro Dah
Daelon DuLac said:
Olsthepols said:
The Dark Brotherhood would keep on killing people for a long time. If the murder of one old woman who makes children live horrible lives means no more Dark Brotherhood then I think its worth it.
Click to expand...
True, true, but I guess I'm not sure on my characters total moral makeup. Do the ends justify the means or is she more concerned with the means. The TG will keep on stealing stuff that people worked hard to get (I know, not always, but still) whether I do anything with them or not, so, what difference does a few murders make, especially since I'm murdering hundreds of bandits, foreswarn, mages and Stormcloaks on a regular basis but justifying it as "they are bad guys" or in the cause of the war.

It gets really murky. Besides, how do we really know their lives are that horrible? Because they say so? At least they're housed, clothed and fed, which is more than I can say for my little Lucia before she met me and any number of other street kids I met during the course of the game. A little slave labor makes them earn their keep. Besides, if she was that bad then the authorities would have done something, right? Maven may be a not nice person, but I can't see, even her putting up with the abuse of children. Where's the profit in that?
Click to expand...


You do know that they have a bad life because 1: When you kill Grelod they are all really happy and they say thank you. 2: When you go into the orphanage you hear Grelod mistreating them.
No one can go their whole life without doing anything bad, so the bad thing you do may as well be to have a good ending. And if you think about it killing bandits and Forsworn is kind of bad. Who are you to judge whether they should live or die? Maybe the bandit was really poor and needed food and gold. When the Forsworn ruled Markarth they were fair rulers, everyone liked them. When Ulfric conquered them he had to execute most of the citizens too because they supported the Forsworn.
 
Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
Olsthepols said:
Daelon DuLac said:
Olsthepols said:
The Dark Brotherhood would keep on killing people for a long time. If the murder of one old woman who makes children live horrible lives means no more Dark Brotherhood then I think its worth it.
Click to expand...
True, true, but I guess I'm not sure on my characters total moral makeup. Do the ends justify the means or is she more concerned with the means. The TG will keep on stealing stuff that people worked hard to get (I know, not always, but still) whether I do anything with them or not, so, what difference does a few murders make, especially since I'm murdering hundreds of bandits, foreswarn, mages and Stormcloaks on a regular basis but justifying it as "they are bad guys" or in the cause of the war.

It gets really murky. Besides, how do we really know their lives are that horrible? Because they say so? At least they're housed, clothed and fed, which is more than I can say for my little Lucia before she met me and any number of other street kids I met during the course of the game. A little slave labor makes them earn their keep. Besides, if she was that bad then the authorities would have done something, right? Maven may be a not nice person, but I can't see, even her putting up with the abuse of children. Where's the profit in that?
Click to expand...


You do know that they have a bad life because 1: When you kill Grelod they are all really happy and they say thank you. 2: When you go into the orphanage you hear Grelod mistreating them.
No one can go their whole life without doing anything bad, so the bad thing you do may as well be to have a good ending. And if you think about it killing bandits and Forsworn is kind of bad. Who are you to judge whether they should live or die? Maybe the bandit was really poor and needed food and gold. When the Forsworn ruled Markarth they were fair rulers, everyone liked them. When Ulfric conquered them he had to execute most of the citizens too because they supported the Forsworn.
Click to expand...
See. Murky.
 
LotusEater

LotusEater

I brake for blue butterflies
Olsthepols said:
You do know that they have a bad life because 1: When you kill Grelod they are all really happy and they say thank you. 2: When you go into the orphanage you hear Grelod mistreating them.
No one can go their whole life without doing anything bad, so the bad thing you do may as well be to have a good ending. And if you think about it killing bandits and Forsworn is kind of bad. Who are you to judge whether they should live or die? Maybe the bandit was really poor and needed food and gold. When the Forsworn ruled Markarth they were fair rulers, everyone liked them. When Ulfric conquered them he had to execute most of the citizens too because they supported the Forsworn.
Click to expand...

The only reason I kill forsworn is because they are such a-holes (and I like their boots and gauntlets). If they would just chill and mind their own business while I'm walking by, everything would be peachy. But no... at first sight they have to come running with their dual swords swinging and threats spewing from their holes. They instigate so therefore they die brutally.
 
Daelon DuLac

Daelon DuLac

How do you backstab a Dragon?
LotusEater said:
Olsthepols said:
You do know that they have a bad life because 1: When you kill Grelod they are all really happy and they say thank you. 2: When you go into the orphanage you hear Grelod mistreating them.
No one can go their whole life without doing anything bad, so the bad thing you do may as well be to have a good ending. And if you think about it killing bandits and Forsworn is kind of bad. Who are you to judge whether they should live or die? Maybe the bandit was really poor and needed food and gold. When the Forsworn ruled Markarth they were fair rulers, everyone liked them. When Ulfric conquered them he had to execute most of the citizens too because they supported the Forsworn.
Click to expand...

The only reason I kill forsworn is because they are such a-holes (and I like their boots and gauntlets). If they would just chill and mind their own business while I'm walking by, everything would be peachy. But no... at first sight they have to come running with their dual swords swinging with threats spewing from their holes. They instigate so therefore they die brutally.
Click to expand...
Frankly, the only reason I kill Foreswarn is because they're always trying to kill me. I don't seek them out, they just ambush me when I'm on the road.
 
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