Reasons why the Companions suck

Sorry, but I really needed to get this off my chest.

Crap jobs
Animal extermination - really? You want me to go traipsing all the way to Winterhold to kill a wolf that's invaded somebody's house. The homeowner can't just get one of the local guards to chase a wolf out of their house? I'm imagining the client thinking "oh, there's a rabid wolf in my house, I better arrange a courier to head all the way to Whiterun along those dangerous paths infested with bandits and bears and packs of wolves to ask the Companions come round and kill the wolf for me."

Pointless
If I'm looking for work, I can just ask the steward or tavern keeper for a job. There are constant job postings for bandits, giants and dragons to be slain, so why bother initiating myself in a gang of warriors for hire?

F#ck being a werewolf
I can't do anything in my beast form. I can't use my skills that I've been honing, I can't craft weapons, I can't use my archery skills to shoot dragons out of the sky. The Companions are there to help villagers and farmers solve their problems, so what good does it do them being able to turn into a dumb beast that everybody is scared of, and the guards will shoot on sight?

Screw avenging Skjor
So after your first night as a werewolf, you have to avenge Skjor. You know, that guy I don't give a f#ck about. I've had like two conversations with him, not very exciting ones at that, and my heart is supposed to be overcome with grief at his loss. It's not like he was a shopkeeper or someone useful to me. At this point, the only companions I'd be sad about losing are Farkas, who helped me in Dustman's Cairn, and Eorlund, who is the only member who hasn't been a dick to me.

If Aela is so sad about Skjor, why doesn't she freaking go wage war against the Silverhand herself? She even berates Skjor for running into battle without a shieled brother, but she expects me to help avenge his death on my own?

The Silverhand doesn't make sense
Speaking of fighting the Silverhand by myself, how is it that I'm able to singlehandedly wipe out a large force of Silverhand warriors in their own hideout, yet during my absense, the Silverhand are able to enter a fortified city, attack the Companions in their own home, and succeed in killing their leader?? Vilkas berates me for not being their to defend Kodlak. Dude, I'm the newest Companion. Surely the rest fo you are capable of protecting your home and the most important member of your group? Oh, apparently, you're not.

It might have made more sense if there was a traitor among the Companions who kills Kodlak, but no need for that, because they're all incompetent enough as it is.

I can't do regular jobs Until I become the Harbinger
It would have worked out fine if, after refusing the gift of Hircine, I could just remain as a regular member of the Companions, doing random jobs alongside Njada, Athis and the other low ranking members, and eventually move the story forward when I want to. But nope, all other quests become locked until I finish the storyline and become the Harbinger. As the new Kodlak, shouldn't I just be sitting in his office writing notes and imparting my wisdom on the other members? Nah, I still have to turn to the Circle for petty tasks.

They should have made Tilma into a spy for the Silverhand. She's been the Companion's cleaning lady her whole life so she knows Jorrvaskr inside out, if they had made the story so that she had a husband or child who died serving the Companions or was killed by a werewolf or something, then she could have been a traitor who helps the Silverhand sneak in through the Underforge to attack Jorrvaskr, and she could have been the one who steals the fragments of Wuuthrad during the attack.

There are some nice bandit mods that make the silver hand their own faction. And for being a werewolf - again there are mods I use for that too. But you are right in that the story isn't really polished.

I like the idea of playing a physically weak character who can change into a beast as a nice compliment play style. Thing is - that weak character isn't really a fit for the companions. So I use a werewolf mod that lets you get the form without that quest line.

Pete said:

There are some nice bandit mods that make the silver hand their own faction. And for being a werewolf - again there are mods I use for that too. But you are right in that the story isn't really polished.

I like the idea of playing a physically weak character who can change into a beast as a nice compliment play style. Thing is - that weak character isn't really a fit for the companions. So I use a werewolf mod that lets you get the form without that quest line.

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It makes more sense to play a weak character who becomes a powerful werewolf, like Sinding. An unassuming farmhand who goes out at night and rips animals and people apart. Or those werewolves on Solsteheim who live in seclusion away from townsfolk.

But joining a famous band of warriors who are all about having their victories remembered in songs and stories, having secret identities as werewolves, is so stupid. If I want to be a famous warrior, then I want people singing about my strength and courage fighting against bandits and giants. I can't exactly do my job in beast form, the townsfolk will be talking like "never heard of that bloke, but did you hear about those necromancers who got slashed up by a werewolf last week?"

You'd think people would become afraid of a werewolf lurking near their town, and ask the Companions to come and kill it. They ask the Companions to kill regular wolves and other wild animals invading their homes and killing their livestock.

They're my favourite vanilla faction (Dawnguard is better) but I do agree with your points except for the werewolf one. I love being a werewolf even in vanilla/without mods.

It's the NPCs I like more than the quests or the story. Well, some of the NPCs.

Did you see how many werewolf heads and carcases the Silverhand have hanging up in their lairs?? They're obviously doing a really good job of keeping the werewolf population down in Skyrim because if you don't join the Companions, then the only other werewolves you're likely to encounter are Sinding and Arnbjorn.

Dawnguard adds werewolves in random encounters, and Dragonborn adds a lot of werecreatures, but as far as the base game goes yeah, werewolves are almost non-existent. Well, live werewolves.

I love companions in all the fallout games. I love the ones available now in FO4 because of how interesting the characters are now. Bethesda stepped up their writing.

However the AI is just plops, man, like damn. As far as I know you can't tell them to come closer or farther or be passive or aggressive. Thing is, those choices are super important if you don't want your companions to randomly run off because there's a bloatfly in the distance. They have a habit of randomly standing still for awhile until I'm far away, then they come sprinting back. They're always too far.

And damn, COMBAT! Like, I'm not too far into the game and the most combat-oriented companions I have available are Codsworth and Strong. But if you have a noncombat-oriented companion, like Piper especially, they get their ass kicked because they run in guns a blazing, hurt one enemy a little, then get incapacitated. They rarely take cover, much less stay back during combat. This strategy would work if I had Strong with me, because he's a badass, but sometimes I want a follower that's good for conversation.

I normally love companions, and I do admit that these ones in FO4 feel so much more alive and complex, but mechanically, they need a ton of improvement.

I like companions, some of them are completely useless but they keep me company.
I married Lydia (what a clichè I know....) so after a while I didn't like the idea of losing her (she always gets stuck in weird places) of having her killed. So I left her home, taking care of our daughter and making sure our cow doesn't get killed by wolves or bandits.
So I hired a guy found in Midwood Isle (a very nice mod from Will Evans). His name is Tyrek, he is a Sun Elf, he often complains when I ask him to carry my stuff and he's always nowehre to be found when there's a battle going on, but his lines in skyrim are fun, so I'll keep him for a while.
(he is very well written, and as he is a from a sunny warm isle when you take him to skyrim he is both fascinated everytime he sees something new and about the fact that people live in such a cold place....he has a lot of lines).
I think I'll fire him soon and hire an archer.

This topic is about The Companions, as in the faction that you can join in Whiterun, not followers in general.

I feel like I should say some things:

Points 1 and 2 - I could say the same things about the fighter's guild of oblivion. Why does the guild exist when they have ways of getting adventurers or even getting the guards to do the job? Guilds for warriors is more to represent that there are groups for adventurers to join.

Point 3 - How can you use anything that requires fine control when beast form is supposed to be a savage beast with little to no mental control at all (in the lore). I think not having access to that stuff makes more sense than the Worgen from World of Warcraft. Also, you really think people are going to hear about a werewolf attacking a gang of bandits in a cave with no prisoners to save? Not really, since bandits would not willingly start talking to civilians in the city's tavern about how a werewolf killed their fellow bandits.

Point 4 - Kodlak is actually pretty smart. One of his conversations he can have with Aela involves the Huntress spending 'too many nights out' and she snaps at him. If she was hunting the Silver hand, and spending days or weeks on end avenging Skjor, it would get picked up almost immediately by Kodlak. Aela even mentions being on edge from 'these hunters' likely referring to the Silver hand.

Point 5 - I do agreee with you for the most part, but the traitor argument does not work too well for me. IF the silver hand were either rogue members of the Companions or actually the other half of the coin with a kind of civil war within the companions regarding the whole Lycanthropy thing (like perhaps Njada and another were offered to become werewolves but rejected because purity) it would work better, them using the bandit silver hand as a cover?

Point 6 - this I agree with wholeheartedly, no need to make an argument on this with me.

Jurgarik Greycloak said:

Point 4 - Kodlak is actually pretty smart. One of his conversations he can have with Aela involves the Huntress spending 'too many nights out' and she snaps at him. If she was hunting the Silver hand, and spending days or weeks on end avenging Skjor, it would get picked up almost immediately by Kodlak. Aela even mentions being on edge from 'these hunters' likely referring to the Silver hand.
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Aela sends the guy/girl who literally only just became a werewolf to go and single-handedly take on a group of werewolf hunters. After we already lost Skjor, a far more seasoned werewolf. When she finds Skjor's body she says "He shouldn't have come without a shield brother" and sends you, the person she was calling a whelp not long ago, to go after other Silverhand members, without a shield brother.

This would have worked better if we got the chance to do other quests for the Companions before Skjor's death occurs, that way we could have had more interaction with Skjor and it would have been more believable that Skjor and Aela come to trust you and see you as a reliable companion, and I might have even believed that my character was feeling with the desire for vengeance.

It just moves forward way too quickly. On the first night you become a werewolf, you wake up outside the very place where Skjor goes off and gets killed. When you wake up from your first transformation, it should have just been in the Underforge, and then Skjor and Aela invite you to perform a couple of other quests as a werewolf, then the quest for Gallows Rock comes up where Skjor dies.

sticky runes said:

Jurgarik Greycloak said:

Point 4 - Kodlak is actually pretty smart. One of his conversations he can have with Aela involves the Huntress spending 'too many nights out' and she snaps at him. If she was hunting the Silver hand, and spending days or weeks on end avenging Skjor, it would get picked up almost immediately by Kodlak. Aela even mentions being on edge from 'these hunters' likely referring to the Silver hand.
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Click to expand...

Aela sends the guy/girl who literally only just became a werewolf to go and single-handedly take on a group of werewolf hunters. After we already lost Skjor, a far more seasoned werewolf. When she finds Skjor's body she says "He shouldn't have come without a shield brother" and sends you, the person she was calling a whelp not long ago, to go after other Silverhand members, without a shield brother.

This would have worked better if we got the chance to do other quests for the Companions before Skjor's death occurs, that way we could have had more interaction with Skjor and it would have been more believable that Skjor and Aela come to trust you and see you as a reliable companion, and I might have even believed that my character was feeling with the desire for vengeance.

It just moves forward way too quickly. On the first night you become a werewolf, you wake up outside the very place where Skjor goes off and gets killed. When you wake up from your first transformation, it should have just been in the Underforge, and then Skjor and Aela invite you to perform a couple of other quests as a werewolf, then the quest for Gallows Rock comes up where Skjor dies.

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Never said it didn't, just that her logic was sound. Send the whelp to do the work, and she can play it off for a little bit as 'I gave him/her a job, he/she is off doing that job.'

Skjor himself is found at the end of the dungeon, with all the silver hand in the dungeon still alive. If you fight smart, rather than foolhardy, they are not much of a threat.

Besides, I hardly see the Circle members even use the Beast Form in the first place. It is best used as a way to prevent Vampirism. First time you see the Circle members, Aela and Farkas, they are fighting a giant near whiterun in HUMAN mode, and I know of only three times the Circle uses that: Farkas in Dustman's Cairn, Aela when you are offered to be given the beast blood, and Skjor who dies in Gallows Rock.

My theory is that Bethesda needed a reason for the Silver hand to be hunting the Companions, so they put the Werewolf stuff in there because of that.