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Palestine and Israel?

Discussion in 'The Lobby' started by Epic Keith, Jul 19, 2014.

  1. Epic Keith

    Epic Keith By Ysmir you're going to FREEZE to death!

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  2. The Honorable Gidian Diva of Sass

    The Honorable Gidian Diva of Sass Sahrot Vahlok Spaan. Bahnahgaar. Minion #88!
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    :eek: I wouldn't believe it if I didn't see it. Israel... wtf are they doing? I know there is that whole biblical rivalry, but this kind of thing is hypocritical... at least it is to Christianity. Idk about Judaism, but I would assume it is as well... Honestly, the guy speaking sounds like a more Godly man than they do.
     
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  3. Epic Keith

    Epic Keith By Ysmir you're going to FREEZE to death!

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  4. Crooksin

    Crooksin Glue Sniffer

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    Israel is disgusting. For 50 years: "pre-emptive strikes", construct illegal occupying settlements, repeat. There is no defence for what they are doing and the only friend they have (and the only one keeping the rest of the world off them) is America.

    On the other side of it, Hamas isn't any better. They both could easily live peacefully together, hell, even unite under one banner like they were living for hundreds of years back in the medieval age.

    My prime minister recently defended Israel's military action in Gaza for whatever reason, just another reason I want to vote him out. This is what he said:

    Its too bad those rocket attacks from Hamas were in retaliation for the brutality of previous Israel attacks and the aggressiveness they showed trying to find those kids that were kidnapped and killed recently. Not a justification, mind you, but so far 342 Palestinians have died and thousands homeless as part of the Gaza offensive and 10 Palestinians were killed looking for those 3 Israeli kids.

     
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  5. Epic Keith

    Epic Keith By Ysmir you're going to FREEZE to death!

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    Over 70 Palestinians killed in Gaza.

    I don't understand how some people don't see this as an act of terrorism. It is barbaric and inhumane and non of the major powers are doing anything against it. Israeli tanks had hit a hospital. A BLOODY HOSPITAL! They may tell the Palestinians to leave but answer this one question. Where do they go?

    "Warning?" said Anas, a 20-year-old university student with a mop of curly black hair who stood on a street corner. "They don't warn us, they kill us."-BBC
     
  6. Crooksin

    Crooksin Glue Sniffer

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    America and Hamas is the two reasons why no ones doing anything. However, I know that Germany refuses to deal with Israel, atm.

    Hamas launches rockets from those hospitals, those residential areas and those schools for the very reason that Israel is going to fire right back on those position. They want to paint Israel the bad guys and they use innocents to do it. Have no idea how those guys were voted in by the Palestinians. Israel has been jumpy, paranoid and ruthless since they were attacked a few times by the rest of the Middle East years ago.

    That said, Israel is so very heavy handed with their retaliations but what they are doing does not fit the terrorist bill. All it would take to end this, guaranteed, is sanctions and a US embargo against Israel even if temporary.
     
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  7. Epic Keith

    Epic Keith By Ysmir you're going to FREEZE to death!

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    United States keeps supplying Israel so an embargo by them is very unlikely. Sure Hamas is attacking from residential areas but bombing those areas? It seems as if they are trying to maximize civilian casualties.
     
  8. Medea

    Medea The Shadow Queen

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    Not touching this thread with a 10 foot pole....
     
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  9. Crooksin

    Crooksin Glue Sniffer

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    that's no fun tho
     
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  10. Seanu Reaves

    Seanu Reaves The Shogun of Gaming

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    Can I touch you woth my ten foot pole though? What about under ten inch pole...
     
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  11. Medea

    Medea The Shadow Queen

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    Okay...I will try to put out my point of view on this subject without getting too emo. Here it goes:

    Does anyone remember the PLO (Palestine Liberation Organization)?? Anyway, they were considered a terrorist organization until 1991, because of their brutal policies and attacks against Israel.

    In 1993 they signed a peace treaty with Israel, backed by Yasser Arafat. This treaty recognized the PLO's right to exist in peace with Israel and they "officially" rejected violence against Israel, becoming the representatives of what the Palestinian people were supposed to be in order for peace to be possible. Negotiations were also made to give most of the Gaza Strip back to the Palestinians, despite many Israelis protesting giving that land away.

    Then, the PLO pretty much dropped off the radar. They went into hiding and were replaced by Hamas. Hamas were a far more brutal and far more zealous group, who used religion (as all Muslim terrorists do) as an excuse to basically wipe a race of people off the map. They have even said they will not stop until they push all of the Jewish people into the sea and eliminate them all....down to every child.

    What did Hamas start doing? Lobbing missiles from Gaza into Israel. The PLO only acted after the Israelis started kicking Hamas's ass, at which time they backed the Hamas's demands for peace with Israel....nice to beg for peace after murdering innocent people for years because you don't believe they should exist, isn't it?

    My point is it doesn't matter if peace arrangements are made, because of religious extremists. If one group makes peace a more brutal group springs up in it's place and takes the reigns of power....then they start the Jihad all over again.

    I know you live in Pakistan Keith and I like you as a person, but maybe the Muslim people should start kicking all the extremists out of their land so these kinds of wars do not happen? Because of those extremists who are always allowed to take over, the peace never lasts.

    I know I sound a little like a hypocrite too, because the U.S. has been involved in official wars with the Middle East for over a decade. The wars I don't agree with. I was never for going to war with the Muslim people since the beginning.....but it's not about the Muslim people. It's about the dicks that are in charge, and when the dicks that are in charge decide they want to wipe out a people (who are more capable in warfare than themselves) because of petty religious differences...not only is it stupid...it's asking for war.

    I look at it this way: If Mexican drug lords started lobbing missiles over the border at U.S. cities and killing our innocents, how long do you think we would wait before we struck back? I guarantee you we would not have near the amount of patience the Israelis have had. Hell...the Mexicans could launch BOTTLE ROCKETS at us over the border and we would go in there like Rambo if they started a fire.
     
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  12. Epic Keith

    Epic Keith By Ysmir you're going to FREEZE to death!

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    I'm against Islamic extremist too and I agree we should get rid of these groups like ISIS. (Pakistani military is currently driving the Taliban out of Pakistan after the two airport attacks)

    The point I was actually concerned with is Israels actions against civilians, even the UN went and called it a war crime.

    If Hamas is using human shields (which I doubt) the sensible course of action is not shooting at the civilian and trying to minimize civilian casualties.
    The same with the hospital. Even if Hamas was using it as a firing spot, it is completely inhumane to bomb it. It's full of sick and injured for crying out loud.
    Some reports even suggest Israel is using chemical weapons.

    Oh, and there was a civilian shot by an Israeli sniper. (disturbing video) http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...iper-lying-defenceless-floor-earlier-hit.html

    I'm no fan of Hamas but I just want to say that Israel has done far worse than what Hamas has done.
     
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  13. Seanu Reaves

    Seanu Reaves The Shogun of Gaming

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    Both have done similar things. To say one is worse than the other just shows a natural bias that ignores truths for the sake of rhetoric. Or some other excuse.
     
  14. Crooksin

    Crooksin Glue Sniffer

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    I think the problem is nobody looks at the entire picture. We either fixate on Palestine and label Israel a post-Hitler regime or we fixate on Hamas and white wash what basically is Israel committing war crimes. Maybe they should send in some UN peacekeepers to diffuse the situations at least for the time being. Send the Canadians in, we'll have em both saying sorry in no time.
     
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  15. Epic Keith

    Epic Keith By Ysmir you're going to FREEZE to death!

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    I hope UN actually does something and end this conflict once and for all. I don't want to debate this again two years later.
     
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  16. DrunkenMage

    DrunkenMage Intoxicated Arch-Mage

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    This is why religion mixed in politics and military do not go together. Humanity should have learned from the Dark Ages, but still it continues.

    UN won't step in, neither will the USA. The United States is too pro Israel to do anything that may upset them, and the UN are biased bureaucrats. This conflict has been going on for awhile with little to no action, but they were quick to jump in and act when the plane was shot down killing Western citizens.
     
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  17. Anouck

    Anouck Queen of Procrastination

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    I would fix this problem this instant, if I could. But I can't. This conflict goes so far back I don't think the UN can solve this. It is typical western arrogance to think you can just go there and make a difference.
    What many people tend to forget, is that generations there grew up hating. Even when te conflict about the land gets solved, there is still that. When you wage wars for years new problems will rise and add to the stack.
     
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  18. mamali

    mamali Well-Known Member

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    I know Hamas started the thing , but to me , looks like Israel is using that as an excuse to kill as many ghaza people as they can . they say Hamas is using people as human shield ? can someone tell me , they bombed UN school in ghaza , where civilians hide to kill hamas people ? they bombed a children's playground where 8 children where playing !
    to me , what Israel is doing right now is no different than what Muslim terrorists been doing for years , the only difference is that israel has other governments on their side . its kinda shocking how everyone , especially UN is pretty quiet about this !
    USA and UN showed they only like peace , humanity and democracy as long as its good for their side .
     
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  19. norsewarlord

    norsewarlord Member

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