Assasin or fighter?

Seanu Reaves · Jun 21, 2015

Your mom doesn't need to heal or chug potions.

But in all seriousness Conjuration is a really good school for hybrids or otherwise.

Nocte Aeterna · Jun 21, 2015

Skies said:
Your mom doesn't need to heal or chug potions.

C'mon, Skies, you're not twelve. >_>

I agree wholeheartedly on the Conjuration bit though. The amount of available summons is increasing through the DLC, and having Seekers and Wrathmen on your side is incredibly fun if you're playing an evil character.

Seanu Reaves · Jun 21, 2015

Nocte Aeterna said:
Skies said:

Your mom doesn't need to heal or chug potions.

Click to expand...

C'mon, Skies, you're not twelve. >_>

I agree wholeheartedly on the Conjuration bit though. The amount of available summons is increasing through the DLC, and having Seekers and Wrathmen on your side is incredibly fun if you're playing an evil character.

I had to, it was right there...

Plus summoned weapons are useful (imo) especially if you are without weapons. Though in my case it only really came up when I was breaking out of prison.

The Honorable Gidian Diva of Sass · Jun 21, 2015

Conjuration's most powerful use is necromancy. Nothing like two Volkihar Thralls to annihilate everything for you.

dunklunk · Jun 21, 2015

Assassin and stealth gets my vote. Just like shadowkitty said, very gratifying pulling off a hit and no one knows where you are. Even better is when you eliminate the target, and he/she's got, like, six friends around and they're ALL freaking out. And then you continue evenly distributing your arrows, until there's no bad guys left. After that? What the hell, it's Miller Time. :beermug:

adge05 · Aug 26, 2015

I've very rarely touched a stealth/assassin style character. My very first character was the aforementioned, but I kept struggling when stealth isn't an option - ie random dragon encounter, Hired Thugs pouncing as you leave somewhere, etc. In those scenarios I kept getting utterly wrecked, as I was unable to go toe-to-toe in open combat.

I'm toying with the idea of attempting such a build once more, and I'm wondering whether anyone has any good strategies to avoid complete annihilation during open combat?

Ru;indil · Aug 26, 2015

I like both but I slightly prefer assassin more as it has a more varied playstyle meaning I can be someone who takes out enemies with my bow in the darkness or an assassin who follows from the enemy's shadow to their leader, slicing his throat etc but warrior is also pretty cool as the battle music playing in synchronization while I charge in and bash my enemy into oblivion is beautiful

.

In the end, it's up to the personal preference of a person.

Balomew · Aug 26, 2015

It depends on the situation. Where are you, what's the weather like, do you have any companions, how many of them are there, are there innocents, and what's the area look like - advantages and disadvantages. I usually go as an "assassin" with a bow in hand and dagger for backup, relying on stealth to keep me alive and sharp pointy things to take care of my opponents quickly and quietly without much fuss. But if you're a good shot or really good at melee stealth or Illusion magic, then fighting alongside a tank would be preferable. Personally, I prefer to be an archer with a stealthy melee companion.

Ru;indil · Aug 26, 2015

Balomew said:
It depends on the situation. Where are you, what's the weather like, do you have any companions, how many of them are there, are there innocents, and what's the area look like - advantages and disadvantages. I usually go as an "assassin" with a bow in hand and dagger for backup, relying on stealth to keep me alive and sharp pointy things to take care of my opponents quickly and quietly without much fuss. But if you're a good shot or really good at melee stealth or Illusion magic, then fighting alongside a tank would be preferable. Personally, I prefer to be an archer with a stealthy melee companion.

I can't agree more.

Daelon DuLac · Aug 26, 2015

More of a philosophical question to me.

I prefer the sneaky type as I find it easier to play a morality that is a little more shady, but, warriors have their virtues as well.

It is far easier to play a "hero" who is a warrior than a hero that is sneaky IMO.

You left out the sneaky assassin mage though. Personally that's one of my favorites. Taking folks out with ice spikes and/or ice spears or simply burning them to death or zapping them and watching 'em twitch. Very satisfying.

To me it also comes down to whether you want to have company on your journeys or are a loner. An assassin would, by nature, be a loner, while a warrior could go either way.

I'm currently playing a warrior so I keep a companion around - not 'cause I need 'em, just 'cause it makes sense.

hershangames · Aug 26, 2015

adge05 said:
I've very rarely touched a stealth/assassin style character. My very first character was the aforementioned, but I kept struggling when stealth isn't an option - ie random dragon encounter, Hired Thugs pouncing as you leave somewhere, etc. In those scenarios I kept getting utterly wrecked, as I was unable to go toe-to-toe in open combat.

I'm toying with the idea of attempting such a build once more, and I'm wondering whether anyone has any good strategies to avoid complete annihilation during open combat?

Open combat is a rough one for early and mid game for a rogue, but I can be easily helped doing one of this(in early game):
-Get an invisibility potion, this will allow you to sneak at any time
-Complete the TG queatline, at the end you can get a power that let's you turn invisible when you crouch, this works as the one above

When you hit higher levels, you can either use invisibility spell(if you're a night blade), the last steth perk, that will allow you to get in stealth mode during g combat(some distance required)(if you're an archer or melee) or have a pitobuttload of stamina and just run to get distance and fire a rain of arrows(of you're an archer).

Also, you can get some one handed and light armor perks to withstand more blows and be able to deal some too.

Aside from that it all comes down to your ability and to how used or comfortable you are at playing like that.

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Balomew · Aug 26, 2015

Daelon, I politely disagree. I usually play rogues but have a hard time making an "evil" character - unruly sometimes, but never chaotic.

Daelon DuLac · Aug 26, 2015

Balomew said:
Daelon, I politely disagree. I usually play rogues but have a hard time making an "evil" character - unruly sometimes, but never chaotic.

We agree to disagree. I enjoy a "rogue" like character too, but a rogue does not commit assassinations or thievery. The are generally duel-wield/archery light armored folks and are not particularly sneaky.

There is a big difference between playing good and evil. One does not have to be particularly either, but you cannot play a sneaky, thieving, assassinating character and ever consider yourself the hero. It doesn't work that way.

Balomew · Aug 26, 2015

Point taken. The term "rogue" has just been used to describe sneaky types, like thieves. My characters are generally sneaky and prefer archery and light armor, though my current in-game character does sometimes steal or pickpocket. As for that last bit about good vs. evil, I again find myself disagreeing. Calling a character good or bad relies on perspective - who's to say if someone is evil or inherently good depending on what they do for a living?

hershangames · Aug 27, 2015

Balomew said:
Point taken. The term "rogue" has just been used to describe sneaky types, like thieves. My characters are generally sneaky and prefer archery and light armor, though my current in-game character does sometimes steal or pickpocket. As for that last bit about good vs. evil, I again find myself disagreeing. Calling a character good or bad relies on perspective - who's to say if someone is evil or inherently good depending on what they do for a living?

I completely agree with you. For example, my preferred char, is a rogue that does all it takes to become emperor of Cyrodiil, even though he's just a Khajit(mainly thanks to expansion mods). And when I said anything, it really is anything. He'll kill whoever stands in his way or send to jail any possible threats, and yet, you can't call him evil, he's pursuing his dreams.

At the same time, I have a rogue that joined the DB for money, and suddenly he saw himself becoming the listener. Yes, he kills people for a living, but how can you call him evil? If he ever joined was because as a Khajit, he couldn't find any job anywhere, and was forced to work underground.

And, at the same time, a rogue can play more the hero than a warrior. A warrior, no matter what level, has to kill every single enemy, whilst a mod leveled rogue can just pass next to me and just kill the boss.

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imaginepageant · Aug 28, 2015

Kalin of High Rock said:
Stealth, especially stealth with ranged attacks, has always been a little too powerful in Bethesda games for my taste. The issue is control. Control of combat. When it happens, where it happens, if it happens at all, is totally in the hands of the stealthy character. You can sneak past whole dungeons of foes, or take them out one at a time.

This is precisely why I prefer stealth builds. I like to be in control. Melee is too chaotic for me.

Is stealth combat overpowered? Sure, a little. But it requires patience and strategy, and that's the trade-off. It will take an assassin three times as long to clear out a dungeon as a warrior, because instead of running in and bashing everything to death, you need to scope out the area, find a good hiding place, lure enemies toward or away from you, study your enemies' movements, snipe and hide, snipe and hide, backstab and hide. It takes time. But I like that, too. Whipping through a dungeon in five minutes flat feels kind of pointless. I like the long, tense, suspenseful adventures you get as an assassin.

hershangames · Aug 29, 2015

imaginepageant said:
This is precisely why I prefer stealth builds. I like to be in control. Melee is too chaotic for me.

Is stealth combat overpowered? Sure, a little. But it requires patience and strategy, and that's the trade-off. It will take an assassin three times as long to clear out a dungeon as a warrior, because instead of running in and bashing everything to death, you need to scope out the area, find a good hiding place, lure enemies toward or away from you, study your enemies' movements, snipe and hide, snipe and hide, backstab and hide. It takes time. But I like that, too. Whipping through a dungeon in five minutes flat feels kind of pointless. I like the long, tense, suspenseful adventures you get as an assassin.

That's exactly what I love the most about being an assassin. And if you're roleplaying the way I do(an ambitious Khajit who doesn't fight unless necessary), the pride you feel when you successfully sneak past an entire dungeon without getting in combat is awesome.

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The Honorable Gidian Diva of Sass · Aug 29, 2015

hershangames said:
Balomew said:

Point taken. The term "rogue" has just been used to describe sneaky types, like thieves. My characters are generally sneaky and prefer archery and light armor, though my current in-game character does sometimes steal or pickpocket. As for that last bit about good vs. evil, I again find myself disagreeing. Calling a character good or bad relies on perspective - who's to say if someone is evil or inherently good depending on what they do for a living?

Click to expand...

I completely agree with you. For example, my preferred char, is a rogue that does all it takes to become emperor of Cyrodiil, even though he's just a Khajit(mainly thanks to expansion mods). And when I said anything, it really is anything. He'll kill whoever stands in his way or send to jail any possible threats, and yet, you can't call him evil, he's pursuing his dreams.

At the same time, I have a rogue that joined the DB for money, and suddenly he saw himself becoming the listener. Yes, he kills people for a living, but how can you call him evil? If he ever joined was because as a Khajit, he couldn't find any job anywhere, and was forced to work underground.

And, at the same time, a rogue can play more the hero than a warrior. A warrior, no matter what level, has to kill every single enemy, whilst a mod leveled rogue can just pass next to me and just kill the boss.

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So what you're saying is, as long as you're just pursuing your dreams, it's not evil. Gotcha.

There's a difference between a moral grey area and taking it to a, in my opinion, ridiculous level. If a psychopath dreams of murdering someone and allows him or herself to succumb to that ambition, he or she is, despite any and all intentions, commiting an evil act. There might be more to his or her personality and character, and he or she might not be in his or her right mind, but he or she is still definitely nowhere near good. Maybe not pure evil, but definitely evil whether he or she intends it or not.

This is almost as ridiculous as someone trying to tell me Kid Buu isn't evil because he is a "kid" and doesn't know any better.

hershangames · Aug 29, 2015

Gidian said:
So what you're saying is, as long as you're just pursuing your dreams, it's not evil. Gotcha.

There's a difference between a moral grey area and taking it to a, in my opinion, ridiculous level. If a psychopath dreams of murdering someone and allows him or herself to succumb to that ambition, he or she is, despite any and all intentions, commiting an evil act. There might be more to his or her personality and character, and he or she might not be in his or her right mind, but he or she is still definitely nowhere near good. Maybe not pure evil, but definitely evil whether he or she intends it or not.

This is almost as ridiculous as someone trying to tell me Kid Buu isn't evil because he is a "kid" and doesn't know any better.

No,no,no,no, you didn't get my point, well, it's my fault for not properly explaining it.

What I meant is: he's pursuing his dreams, and if achieving his dreams requires killing someone, he won't hesitate. Neither will he if someone stands in his way.

He's not evil, he just needs to commit "evil" acts in order to achieve his goals. And his goals aren't evil.

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The Honorable Gidian Diva of Sass · Aug 29, 2015

hershangames said:
Gidian said:

So what you're saying is, as long as you're just pursuing your dreams, it's not evil. Gotcha.

There's a difference between a moral grey area and taking it to a, in my opinion, ridiculous level. If a psychopath dreams of murdering someone and allows him or herself to succumb to that ambition, he or she is, despite any and all intentions, commiting an evil act. There might be more to his or her personality and character, and he or she might not be in his or her right mind, but he or she is still definitely nowhere near good. Maybe not pure evil, but definitely evil whether he or she intends it or not.

This is almost as ridiculous as someone trying to tell me Kid Buu isn't evil because he is a "kid" and doesn't know any better.

Click to expand...

No,no,no,no, you didn't get my point, well, it's my fault for not properly explaining it.

What I meant is: he's pursuing his dreams, and if achieving his dreams requires killing someone, he won't hesitate. Neither will he if someone stands in his way.

He's not evil, he just needs to commit "evil" acts in order to achieve his goals. And his goals aren't evil.

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Oh. Well that's different to an extent, however who is really going to buy your character not being evil if he commits a bunch of evil acts? Actions speak louder than words and the best of intentions won't change facts. Unless you're talking about some form of "necessary" evil, which is more understandable.

Assasin or fighter?

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