Spoiler Level 1 - mage advice needed - this thread contains spoilers

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Sah

Well-Known Member
WARNING
this thread will contain spoilers


hello every one :)

this one has discovered that we have the best Wiki here on this site....all you have to do is ask! :)


I have not played as a mage in over a year :oops:, specialized in warrior tactics & mind set, I have to change that mind set fast and start thinking like a Mage........the get in up close & personal will get me Dead :sadface:


I am in very desperate need of information on a Mage build & there are strict conditions that apply,

must start at level 1 as a mage and complete as much of the game as I can before I die on Expert or Master........no armors, no fast travel, no followers, no training, smiting & enchanting restrictions might apply.......& a 30 day ending

  1. I need to get to the best (MUST BE BEST) Robes & staffs fast...need recommendations of types & location
  2. Best vanilla race for a mage build
  3. As for perks....recommended allocation for fastest strongest build?
  4. Best recommended strategies for attack and deference
  5. Best magic spells to buy........money will be a big issue so cant waste it
  6. Recommendations of easiest quests to complete as a mage at low levels 1-20
  7. Recommendations of must AVOID quests........must stay alive

any tips I can use are well appropriated thanks:)


PS#1: if smiting & enchanting restrictions don't apply.....will need to stay alive long enough till I get my spellbraker & a good mace.......then every thing dies!:cool:

PS#2: looking at questions 1-7 they could be a thread on there own......sorry about that
 
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Nocte Aeterna

Sir Not-Appearing-in-This-Film
Right, this is going to be long and spoiler-filled, but I hope it gives you a fair bit of information. This is WITHOUT your restrictions, so hopefully this will let you figure out what to do with said restrictions.

1. Doing the College quests will get you some of the best robes in the game. Otherwise, I'd become a vampire and nab the Ring of Erudite.
2. High Elf, if you're going offensive, since they get a sizable +50 boost to their magicka right from the get-go and their racial power lets them regenerate magicka extremely rapidly once per day. It's the race I would most recommend for higher difficulties, but Breton and Dark Elf are also good choices.
3. Alteration and Conjuration will be your primary forms of defense and support, backed by Destruction and Restoration. I wouldn't recommend Illusion for a pure mage build since I find that to be more stealth-catered.
4. Never rush into combat; survey potential danger first by looking around sharp corners (a clever way of doing this without tilting the camera angle or positioning yourself into a risky spot would be to simply cast Detect Life/Dead or using the Aura Whisper shout). Always cast flesh spells first (that is, Oakflesh, Stoneflesh, and so on), since you definitely will be OHKO'd by higher level enemies without that extra armor rating. That being said, you should almost never be too close to an enemy. Between your conjured atronachs and destruction spells, you should be able to take them out without too much incident in most cases. Either way, a mage is squishy, so you'll need to be moving around a lot. As for element of spellcraft, all three have their perks. Fire does the most damage, frost slows your enemies down, and shock hits the fastest and most accurately. It's really up to you. I'd go with fire if I were a newbie, though - most balanced of the three, and you'll probably want to focus on damage output.
5. Unfortunately, being a mage is expensive. Paralyze is a wonderful spell to have at higher levels, and I'd recommend virtually every spell save for a few. If you're concerned about dropping a lot of money on tomes, keep in mind that you'll end up with a lot of loot at the end of the day regardless of difficulty level. Alternatively, you could play the douche mage and steal things and sell them to the Thieves Guild for coin.
6. The College of Winterhold questline can be done in almost its entirety. Labyrinithian is probably better for level 25+, though, since you face a Dragon Priest at the end of it.
7. The only quest I could think of you avoiding is the Dawnbreaker quest, since the mage at the end of that one is an absolute asshat and extremely overpowered. But really, with the proper perks and training, as well as potions and any enhancing items that you have on hand, you should be able to tackle virtually any threat. Also, you're a mage - no reason for you to use a sword.

A typical pure mage setup that I like to run (with great results) is usually something like this:

Race: High Elf
Standing Stone: Mage, then Atronach/Lord (use Aetherial Crown). If you don't have Dawnguard, stick with Atronach - the regen nerf is easily fixable.

Skill Spread (Level 50)

Destruction: Novice-Master, Dual Casting, Impact, Augmented Flames* (2/2), Intense Flames*
Alteration: Novice-Master, Mage Armor (3/3), Magic Resistance (3/3), Stability
Conjuration: Novice-Master, Summoner (2/2), Atromancy**, Elemental Potency**, Twin Souls
Restoration: Novice-Adept, Regeneration, Ward Absorb, Recovery (2/2), Avoid Death
Enchanting: Enchanter (5/5), Insightful Enchanter, Corpus Enchanter, Extra Effect

*Can be replaced with their frost or lightning equivalents if you prefer, but I'd only pick one element to start.
** Can be swapped with necromancy perks if you prefer, but I find atromancy easier.

Obviously, my guide isn't really a guide - more of an account of my own experiences. Hope this helps, and I also hope it isn't too daunting. Part of playing a character is rooted in mixing and matching and experimenting with different skills to determine which build you're most comfortable with playing!
 

Papoy

DON'T EXPECT SPOILER WARNINGS FROM ME
My toughts allmost same.
I dont rly have some objections, not that i think its wrong, just a different idea.
First of all, i take dual cast aletration, so i dont need to recast in longer fights. Dont like grinding, so no enchanting eiter (all IMO). I DO take illusion, true that its more with sneaky chars, but it helped me a lot when passing skuldafn (muffle-invisiblity-mayhem)
I reccomend joining college for novice robes of destruction. Then DB questline. You will get lots of money just by doing first few nazirs contracts.
You shouldnt feel worried about money, if you wear only clothes than they wont even take out 5 of your carrying capacity. Lets say u have about 40 more taken out by potions, 5 more for scrolls thats 250 out of 300. 250 free space for loot. Lot easier to make money than warrior, right? ;)
I personaly like Dunmers more, because of power that can help u if u cant avoid close combat (or if u want to troll :p :) ) But thats just my opinion (and i dont like H.E. cuz i hate Thalmor :p ).
Piece of advice, btw. If u happen to come across the ice wolf by some accident, run. Theyve been real nightmare to me, ofc later, ull turn them into dust before they know what happend. Sayin this cuz u said u wont do fast travel, so, try to avoid northen parts somehow. (hah, totaly opposite to what i said before, nazir asks u to kill betild in dawnstar. I wish u luck)

EDIED: About magica/health/stamina lvling. Go by your instinct. I rly dont have a schedule on this one. Except that i dont invest in stamina.
Standing stones: natrualy, start with mage stone. Then u can turn to atronach, apprentice, or even ritual stone.
And jewlery, i'd focus flat magica rather than magica regen, therefore, i prefer takin atronach stone above all else.
 
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Reaper87

吉光
My two cents on suitable races:

High Elf
(imo) is the best starting all-around mage race, as their racial ability and power are extremely helpful at lower levels, especially if you are going for a pure mage. The High Elf's starting skills, as you probably know, are all based around magic, which will give you a nice head start to all things magic.

Second best would be Dark Elf, if you were going for a mainly destruction-based mage (and plus both males and females look really cool).

Finally, if you were seeking a battlemage-type build, I'd go with Breton, as they are flexible and have the useful magic-resist traits which you can expand upon later in the game, if you wish.

I hope this helps, and good luck!
 
Right, this is going to be long and spoiler-filled, but I hope it gives you a fair bit of information. This is WITHOUT your restrictions, so hopefully this will let you figure out what to do with said restrictions.

1. Doing the College quests will get you some of the best robes in the game. Otherwise, I'd become a vampire and nab the Ring of Erudite.
2. High Elf, if you're going offensive, since they get a sizable +50 boost to their magicka right from the get-go and their racial power lets them regenerate magicka extremely rapidly once per day. It's the race I would most recommend for higher difficulties, but Breton and Dark Elf are also good choices.
3. Alteration and Conjuration will be your primary forms of defense and support, backed by Destruction and Restoration. I wouldn't recommend Illusion for a pure mage build since I find that to be more stealth-catered.
4. Never rush into combat; survey potential danger first by looking around sharp corners (a clever way of doing this without tilting the camera angle or positioning yourself into a risky spot would be to simply cast Detect Life/Dead or using the Aura Whisper shout). Always cast flesh spells first (that is, Oakflesh, Stoneflesh, and so on), since you definitely will be OHKO'd by higher level enemies without that extra armor rating. That being said, you should almost never be too close to an enemy. Between your conjured atronachs and destruction spells, you should be able to take them out without too much incident in most cases. Either way, a mage is squishy, so you'll need to be moving around a lot. As for element of spellcraft, all three have their perks. Fire does the most damage, frost slows your enemies down, and shock hits the fastest and most accurately. It's really up to you. I'd go with fire if I were a newbie, though - most balanced of the three, and you'll probably want to focus on damage output.
5. Unfortunately, being a mage is expensive. Paralyze is a wonderful spell to have at higher levels, and I'd recommend virtually every spell save for a few. If you're concerned about dropping a lot of money on tomes, keep in mind that you'll end up with a lot of loot at the end of the day regardless of difficulty level. Alternatively, you could play the douche mage and steal things and sell them to the Thieves Guild for coin.
6. The College of Winterhold questline can be done in almost its entirety. Labyrinithian is probably better for level 25+, though, since you face a Dragon Priest at the end of it.
7. The only quest I could think of you avoiding is the Dawnbreaker quest, since the mage at the end of that one is an absolute asshat and extremely overpowered. But really, with the proper perks and training, as well as potions and any enhancing items that you have on hand, you should be able to tackle virtually any threat. Also, you're a mage - no reason for you to use a sword.

A typical pure mage setup that I like to run (with great results) is usually something like this:

Race: High Elf
Standing Stone: Mage, then Atronach/Lord (use Aetherial Crown). If you don't have Dawnguard, stick with Atronach - the regen nerf is easily fixable.

Skill Spread (Level 50)

Destruction: Novice-Master, Dual Casting, Impact, Augmented Flames* (2/2), Intense Flames*
Alteration: Novice-Master, Mage Armor (3/3), Magic Resistance (3/3), Stability
Conjuration: Novice-Master, Summoner (2/2), Atromancy**, Elemental Potency**, Twin Souls
Restoration: Novice-Adept, Regeneration, Ward Absorb, Recovery (2/2), Avoid Death
Enchanting: Enchanter (5/5), Insightful Enchanter, Corpus Enchanter, Extra Effect

*Can be replaced with their frost or lightning equivalents if you prefer, but I'd only pick one element to start.
** Can be swapped with necromancy perks if you prefer, but I find atromancy easier.

Obviously, my guide isn't really a guide - more of an account of my own experiences. Hope this helps, and I also hope it isn't too daunting. Part of playing a character is rooted in mixing and matching and experimenting with different skills to determine which build you're most comfortable with playing!


I agree with Nocte, except for two things. One, having the Atronach Stone and Magic Resistance fully perked at the same time can cause a lot of glitches. Especially if you're summoning things. With patience he's right, it's fixable. But not everyone has the patience to summon Atronachs before battle and whenever they wear off, which as far as I know is the only fix to not end up re-absorbing the spell. I tried it myself and didn't have the patience. However you could also get a staff or scroll to summon your Atronach of choice - the only problem being, they don't come cheap. You said you were worried about coin. There is a chance you can loot them in dungeons (though I don't think they appear until the mid to upper levels, could be wrong); and I believe when/if you become Arch-Mage there's a free one in the Arch-Mage's Quarters, on the top shelf next to the bed there. But that's if you want to become Arch-Mage and tbh even then I'm unsure if that's only happened in my game or not. :/
Secondly, he has a point about becoming a Vampire Lord if you have the Dawnguard DLC. However, I would recommend making your mage have a sneakier bent to them if you do this. What I mean by that is - invest in the Illusion magic school. Vampire Lords get a boost to Illusion that makes it much more accessible, and Illusion magic will also make it easier to feed while walking the lands of Skyrim. Wouldn't hurt to work on alchemy, as well, or enchanting. You'll need one or the other as a Vampire Lord if you're going to not fast travel and walk during the day, to restart your health/stamina/magicka regen, and for fire resistance (though you could also choose Dunmer as a race for fire resistance - it's what I did :p). If you have the Dawnguard DLC, be sure to pick up the Vampire Royal Armor as soon as possible. It's technically light armor but with 125% magicka regen enchanted on it, it's some of the best mage armor in the game. It's also a good fall back to have if you run out of magicka to cast Flesh spells.
Also if you go the VL route, you may want to consider the Necromage perk in the Restoration (I believe?) skill tree. I would only take that however if you wanted to dabble in necromancy. The spell tomes you pick up in the Soul Cairn are technically effected by necromancy perks, and they are pretty powerful summons.
Anyway, hope this helps. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Sah

Well-Known Member
all those restrictions...sounds like hell tbh...no fast travel?

yep:).......the restrictions are part of a competition DiD or Dead is Dead.....its a game where people are given a Build (mage - this is round 4)...you start at level 1.....onece you enter the Keep DiD rules apply.......restrictions are set like from the above post, you pick a difficulty, 2 options (Expert or Master).....and you play till you Die!:eek:.....one life as far as you can get:confused:.....there is a point system for everything you do in the game...and you have a 2 week time frame to accomplish this!;)

this one has been accepted to take part in DiD round 4....held on the Bethesda Forums
:D
 

Papoy

DON'T EXPECT SPOILER WARNINGS FROM ME
yep:).......the restrictions are part of a competition DiD or Dead is Dead.....its a game where people are given a Build (mage - this is round 4)...you start at level 1.....onece you enter the Keep DiD rules apply.......restrictions are set like from the above post, you pick a difficulty, 2 options (Expert or Master).....and you play till you Die!:eek:.....one life as far as you can get:confused:.....there is a point system for everything you do in the game...and you have a 2 week time frame to accomplish this!;)

this one has been accepted to take part in DiD round 4....held on the Bethesda Forums
:D

If so, then you will LOVE illusion. Very good for avoiding fights.
 

Kohlar the Unkilled

Time for some ale
All great posts above. I'll make some points of my own, if it's not too late. I realize some of these may be repeated from previous posts, but deserve emphasis.

I like the Dunmer for their fire resistance and appearance. With my mage, after discovering Whiterun and conducting some early business there, I engaged the main quest. Bleakfalls Barrow is relatively easy and an opportunity for early loot. I killed the dragon at the watchtower, (mainly by cowering within the watchtower...), and I did it for two reasons. Unrelenting force's first shout is great for staying alive in tight situations; Lydia is a much better fighter than Uthgerd the Unbroken, and will be indispensable as protection on the long road to the College, to which you will embark upon claiming the Jarl's reward for your valor. I completed the entire College questline by level 10, (may've died a couple times, but you'll be more careful). When you reach the boss of Labyrinthian, Morokei, Lydia will do much of the fighting, as you'll be taking cover from the storm atronach that he summons, but you'll still get some shots in from a distance. :beermug: ...And that is where my advice will end, as my experience as a mage on Skyrim is slight compared to many here.

But one more thing! Enchanting can be a huge advantage if you have the opportunity to build it up. Embracing the idea of being a Shield Mage, you would use an enchanted dagger as a melee weapon, (though I'll admit that my mage used heavier weapons early on when the need arose). My Dragon Priestess has a dagger that slices through Deathlords like soft cheese.

Oh, and avoid Dwemer ruins at all costs. They're nightmarish for low level mages. Here's to your journey. :beermug:
 

Sah

Well-Known Member
here is one for the Experts:eek:
BTW thanks for the advice.......you all cant imagine how much you helped:)..........thank you all:D

Bound Sword

  1. what damage rating dose it have when you use it?
  2. will it be the same as what you have equipped.........Iron sword 30pts......is bound sword also 30pts?
  3. what is the affect on damage rating if you use double damage perk?
  4. if you use bound sword you get an increase in Congering .....do you get the same increase on 1 x handed weapons?
  5. dose the 1 x handed weapons perk tree affect bound sword?
  6. and dose it have to be a sword, what if you have a mace or ax?

if I'm to play the mage might as well use by biggest strength for close combat situations.....but need to know above info to make a choice on difficulty Expert or Master


the only thing I remember is that it can be used to fill soul gems (soul trap) witch will be handy for filling up empty gems
 
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Kohlar the Unkilled

Time for some ale
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but:

1. and 2. Damage rating is the same as base daedric weapon.
3. double damage
4. Yes ..... Yes
5. I do believe so, yes
6. I believe there is bound options for the sword, axe, and and dagger, no mace.
 

Sah

Well-Known Member
1. and 2. Damage rating is the same as base daedric weapon.

do you remember that base numbero_O......and how can it be increased legally:rolleyes:
the part that confuses me is regardless of what physical weapon I have and damage ratings......when I use bound sword my rating will drop to base Daedric?....YES/NOo_O
If I have a real daedric sword and upgrade it will that show in bound sword or do I stay on the base?:confused:


PS your the best hehehe:p
 

JoeReese

Well-Known Member
I think the base damage on the Daedric sword is 14, but that is of course subject to influence by your one-handed skill level, your 1 through 5 armsman perks, one-handed enchantments, potions, and any other damage-affecting things you do. As far as I know, whatever player-originated damage effects you have will carry over to your bound sword, but weapon-originated effects (such as smithing and enchantments) will not. There is a "Mystic Binding" perk in the conjuration tree, which will make the bound sword do more damage, but I'm not sure how much more damage. I'll try to pop into creation kit and find out. If memory serves, once cast, you can also poison them.

If it were me, I'd focus on your magical perks first, of course, but when you have some extra, put 5 of them into armsman, one into fighting stance, and get that mystic binding perk. As far as race, I would suggest a Breton for the 25% magic resistance, and then take the Lord stone for 50 pts of physical resistance and another 25% magic resistance. IMO, destruction magic is so under powered that having a few extra points of magic won't make as much difference as being resistant to incoming spells.

I think a few other people have mentioned the College for magical gear and quests, but it's also a free bed and some safe storage (cabinets only, not barrels.) There's also a constant Elven dagger in Journeyman's nook, down the road from the college, across from the mine. At low levels, that hits harder and faster than an iron sword. Every little bit helps.

I haven't been a big proponent of dual casting, since I read that it costs more magicka than simply casting single spells with each hand, but then I'm not usually without armor or follower, and I think the impact perk will prove to be useful to you. If you're using your bound sword, I have found good results with a short burst of flame from the left hand, just to get them burning, while you hack away with the sword.

It will eat up some of your stamina, but my fav special attack is to tap the attack button once, release, and then hold it in, in quick succession. This will combine a standard attack with an instantaneous power attack, sort of a side swipe and downward smash, to give you more damage in less time.

That's all I can think of for the moment. I'll be back when I've poked around creation kit and hopefully have some idea about the extra damage for bound sword.
 

shadowkitty

Mistress of Shadows
Couldn't be bothered reading all the replies, but here is my little bit of input. Apologies if I repeat anything anyone has already said.

Whenever you duel wield, if you cast one hand and then the other straight away, that counts for two so you level up quicker.
Levelling up with bound weapons can be spammed if you find an enemy and engage.. then keep them chasing you (like around a tree stump of something) while casting and sheathing your bound weapon/s repeatedly. As long as you are still technically engaged with your foe, you will continue to level up.

Also Runes are your friends. Find the rune spell books and use them,...like...everywhere. I have a mage who almost exclusively uses fire runes and it is awesome. It really helps to keep your character away from enemies while still dealing them damage. Plus, it's a plops-tonne of fun.
 

LuChao

The Martial artist
here is one for the Experts:eek:
BTW thanks for the advice.......you all cant imagine how much you helped:)..........thank you all:D

Bound Sword

  1. what damage rating dose it have when you use it?
  2. will it be the same as what you have equipped.........Iron sword 30pts......is bound sword also 30pts?
  3. what is the affect on damage rating if you use double damage perk?
  4. if you use bound sword you get an increase in Congering .....do you get the same increase on 1 x handed weapons?
  5. dose the 1 x handed weapons perk tree affect bound sword?
  6. and dose it have to be a sword, what if you have a mace or ax?

if I'm to play the mage might as well use by biggest strength for close combat situations.....but need to know above info to make a choice on difficulty Expert or Master


the only thing I remember is that it can be used to fill soul gems (soul trap) witch will be handy for filling up empty gems
your bound weapons are bound sword bound dagger bound bow and bound battle ax
 

Papoy

DON'T EXPECT SPOILER WARNINGS FROM ME
U can check ur bound weapon dmg by casting it, and enetring invertory than "weapons" part. It will display there.

The same way, i think i know the bonus that dual cast gives. i cast Greater ward with one hand, and natrualy got 80 armor. with two hands i got 160, natrualy. But dual casted, i got 176. That is 80+80+16. 16 is 1/5 of 80. I can only say this for restoration school. IDK if dual casted distruction applies same way, but ull definetly find Impact life saving.

Make sure to have those Sleeping Tree saps. Might blind ur vision a bit, but incriesing ur hp by 100 aint small thing.

Also, Shalidor insights, scrolls that give u buffs related to specific school of magic (bonus dmg/affects higher lvl "something"/longer duration and less magica cost). The orc in the arcanium gives u quest to retrieve them. Just ask: "are there any special books u are lookin for?" ull get the quest, once u have retrieved the book, ull have to wait 1-2 days to get scrolls. Ull get each time for different school, at random, 3 pieces for 1 book. name of the quest is Shalidor insights (HA, i bet u couldnt quess it! :) )

I gave u crapy explanation, sory about that. Note: u wont allways be able to get this quest, as it wont appear in his dialogue right after uve just finished last one. So ull have to wait. Also, books arent so easy to get, as it can lead u to a stupid bandit camp, it can also lead u to nordic ruins (in the main chamber), to me it once even appeared in dwarven ruin.
 

Reaper87

吉光
U can check ur bound weapon dmg by casting it

Also, Sah, I believe that there is a perk in the Conjuration skill tree that allows you to do greater damage with bound weapons (sword, bow, battleaxe, daggers (DB) ), 'Mystic Binding'. You need Conjuration level 20 and the perk 'Novice Conjuration' - this perk could help you out at lower levels. I also remember a perk that allowed bound weapons to fill soul gems, though I cannot remember its name. :)

I would also invest in the mage armour spells (the ones with the 'flesh' suffix) to provide vital protection. If you grind your Alteration to 90, Tolfdir at the college will give you the over-powered 'Dragonhide' spell, upon completion of the 'Alteration Ritual Spell'.

I'm sure you already know about this, but I just thought that I'd pitch in some more ideas to help. ;)

Personally, I would choose High Elf as my race for this build (if you have not done so already)


It would be good if you decided which were going to be your main forms of magic, and then proceed to enchant your gear with 25%+ reduction enchantments. Healing spells that cost nothing would be a great advantage when fighting enemies on Expert or Master difficulty. :D
 
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JoeReese

Well-Known Member
Ok, so I checked creation kit for the bound swords. It seems as though there's not just a perk but also two separate bound swords, boundweaponsword and boundweaponswordmystic. Sword has a base damage of 7, and mystic has a base damage of 14 (which matches the uesp base damage for daedric sword.) If I'm not mistaken, I believe the developers tried to nerf the lower level bound sword, so as to avoid having a lvl 4 player with the 1-shot-kill power of a deadric sword. Now, what I don't know is whether the mystic version of the sword is the one cast when you have the mystic perk, or whether it just goes by conjuration level, but I will dig further into that. Knowing the devs, it could go either way, because creation kit is anything but consistent.

Outside of that, there is a mystic perk which raises the damage value of bound weapons by 20. I *think* what that means is you cast the lower level bound sword up to a certain conjuration level, and then you get the "mystic" version, separate from the mystic perk which adds a flat 20. More on that as I figure out exactly wth they did in there.

Something Kitty mentioned about raising conjuration level with the swords, you can also aggro the slaughterfish and then stand safely on shore with a conjuration (sword or atronach, zombie, etc.) and for as long as there are red dots in your compass bar, the leveling will consider you "in combat." Easier with bound weapons, as atronachs have this tendency to kill your sparring partners too quickly.

mysticperk.jpg
 

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