Imperials or Stormcloaks, what one?

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DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
Probably ran off to prepare to bust Ulfric free, as implied with their documents you find in their embassy.

I think that is how he escaped Helgen during the chaos. Thalmor would have made sure he got back to Windhelm.

True, but I still think Ulfric deserved a bit of a trial before killing him off. Even if its just for show.

They don't really do proper trials for High Treason. The last time it was an Elder Council member and he met with the exact same fate Ulfric was about to.

Then maybe you should note disclaimers. Another Imperial backer in this thread quoted you by name, though the quote itself was relatively vague.

However, I do retract my statement with a minor apology. It's not you who claims you are right, no. Rather, the abundance of which you claim. All this time to pass, and here you are, commenting more than anyone else (Raijin included). It isn't hard to think that someone defending a position so fervently would know what he's talking about, thus an illusion of abundant knowledge is made through an ironic ignorance, be the ignorance concerning the side you defend, the reason you defend, or you yourself. Just something to think about.

I learn new bits of lore all the time, Rimfaxe actually has more knowledge than I. Defending the Empire or the Stormcloaks isn't very hard, I can do both and have done in the past on my Stormcloak account.

Does Worshiping Talos condone murder? If you murder someone in Stormcloak Riften, is it still not a crime?

Yeah it does, or more correctly the "Talos Cult" does. If you murder someone in Riften, it is only a crime if you can't pay the bribe.


Not that I should help mention this, but you could also cite the resistance in Cyrodiil during the occupation. It was referenced in-game during the Dark Brotherhood Wedding Murder Quest.

I'm not aware of it? Which resistance?

Ignoring that, I don't know if they fought and died for nothing... Just they fought and died for not as much as they did.

As Brunwulf would say "The 'Great War'- there was nothing great about it. Thousands died on both sides and where did we end up? Did we really save the Empire or did we just plant the seeds for Ulfric's uprising and another war?"


Fair enough. Still, they could always make appeals, not that there would be much they could appeal for. And, as always, part of their taxes would go to Solitude, being part of that fealty of course.

Maybe, depends how the Nords govern themselves regarding taxes. For all we know tax evasion could be the national sport of Jarls.

How long did Torygg rule, exactly?

I'd less than a year maybe? He was a very recent High King and I believe Ulfric rode to Solitude not too long after the Moot elected him. His father had ruled for twenty five years.

Aren't politics fun?

Only in High Rock.


Exactly. The men are locally recruited and trained (though there are some Imperials in the legion, but I think they joined SPECIFICALLY from Cyrodiil to help the Empire). Thus, all the men who are fighting now are fighting as soldiers who wouldn't be part of the initial legions. So in a way, the trouble the Aldmeri Dominion are stirring isn't too significant at all.

There are many ex Legionaries in the Stormcloaks. That would have taken a chunk out of the Legions. All the men fighting are good able soldiers who could be conscripted or enlisting. While they're not on the border, they're still something you can train up and reinforce.

The trouble they're stirring is a problem, because the longer it drags on the more resources it eats up. The more Officers you lose, the more locals who can be recruited for the next more etc.

Against who?

Aldmeri Dominion during Tiber's day wiped out a Legion, the Moth rebellion made Tiber lose control of the Imperial City. War of the Red Diamond cost several Legions and the sacking of the Imperial City, the invasion of Akavir saw a great number of Legions weakened and one basically wiped out + the Emperor dead. Oblivion Crisis the Empire barely survived, the thing with Umbriel several legions lost and the Empire nearly falling again.

Empire gets hit hard every so often.

If I recall, Talos wasn't exactly the kindest of Conqueror Kings. Infact, he was sort of a douchebag.

Talos makes the Thalmor seem nice. He wasn't kind, if he couldn't use he'd just kill you. Conquerer, slavery, tyrant. People loved him all the same. Helped with him and his dynasty making propaganda about stuff.

Skyrim doesn't seem to have a lot of science. So, whenever something happens they blame magic or themselves for angering the gods. Why'd the dragons come back. CLEARLY because we stopped worshipping Talos, of course.

That is just Nords, they're very superstitious people. Kind of sad to see them turn their backs on Mages and magic, it now being shunned and feared in parts.

I don't buy into it, but a lot of people (in Skyrim) would and do. Gods don't take hits, they take offense.

Well I suppose they would. It is strange they're not worshipping Ysmir, makes me wonder how much influence the Imperial Cult and Talos Cult have had... Especially since I think a lot of things surrounding Talos were propaganda to help the Septims keep control over the Nords.

If I recall, doesn't the Aldmeri Dominion eventually give in to the Redguard with the Second Treaty of Stros M'kai? We don't know what military engagements the Aldmeri had to deal with, apart with Hammerfell. But, if they were able to beat them out, then that means something was up. They know how to play they cards, they know how to bluff, how to maintain a cool complexion when their hair is on fire. Their greatest advantage against the Empire is that the Empire doesn't know pl*** about the Aldmeri. All we know is what they had and what wasn't reinforced. After the Imperial City was retaken, there were no reports of more troops crossing the borders.

The Redguards didn't get their truce easily, took five years and left their province devastated. The Empire was barely left standing, the Redguards are warriors, their children are warriors and their rulers are skilled in strategy.

It is easier fighting for your homes, in your lands. You know them better than the enemy.

The Empire is a complex machine, it has to keep moving, once it stalls it is a bitch to get it going again. With Cyrodiil in flames, much destroyed the various levels of governments no longer in place etc. It starts to collapse, and you lose order.

The Legions remaining on the attack, also having to take on duties of common guards. They need to secure trade shipments, cities, keep the roads safe. Even if Mede was to reject the White-Gold Concordat, what could he do? He can't attack the Dominion, the Legions weren't even in a shape to keep the peace once the war had ended for awhile.

Aldmeri were in control of Southern Hammerfell. I doubt Mede could send much into Hammerfell without risking the collapse of Cyrodiil.

Or luck. Some people are just unfortunately lucky, look at the many assassination attempts on Hitler.

Seems a bit too much for luck. He was only captured when Tullius took command, so we get the choices of; Thalmor, luck, Ulfric got owned by a better strategist.


Don't forget to mention that one of those Shipping Companies belongs to the Empire.

They're an independent merchant guild.

Not asking them to win the war, asking for a White Peace, where its a relative draw, would suffice enough.

Empire asked for peace when they couldn't continue. Aldmeri were able to continue for five more years.


Not at the beginning. Rikke says he wants to surrender and that she still wants to fight.

Says he's given up, his forces destroyed and the city overrun. But, yeah I suppose.

Tullius joins her, but probably because his Strategist Mind comes to the conclusion that 3vs2 is better than 3vs1. Then, he falls over saying he's not the enemy and is reminded that he isn't the good guy, either.

Or he jumps to the aid of his Legate, because he isn't a coward.

There are no good guys.

Truthfully, I think Ulfric should have spared Tullius. Sent him back with a demand of recognized sovereignty. It'd also help the Empire with their next war (assuming it comes in this lifetime) so Ulfric won't have to worry about Aldmeri looking at their borders. But, as we already know, he doesn't have a strategist's mind. He's rash, impulsive, and aims for a better story.

Aye, in good faith to form a defensive and trade agreement treaty with the Imperials. I agree he should have spared him and accepted surrender. War might get worse for both sides, Ulfric executing Tullius and Tullius executing Ulfric could lead to creating martyrs/retaliation.

Or mages to explode the doors open or something.

Doubt the Nords would want to fight alongside many of those.

People aren't bolted to the walls and the doors weigh tons rather than pounds. Fus Ro Dah is useful, but only against human opponents.

In the game mechanics it is, but since is it the only Thu'um that sends things flying. We can gather it is the one the Nords have used to break open gates in the past.

I'd take a guess and say the power of the Thu'um depends on what you're trying to do. You can knock someone over or smash down a giant gate, just depends on your control.

I doubt that half is the one with Windhelm in it. I also don't think he'd have much control over the half he controls, not with the Jarls being placed on thrones. Its more a reminder of what side they're on, I'd imagine.

Galmar isn't subtle, he's more enforcer than kind reminder.


Wait, wait, wait. How can you dislike Dunmer? They're the only Elves that are tolerable.

I like House Telvanni, because I like Mages. In general they don't really appeal to me.


The guard can be easily corrupted anywhere. If they agree with the agitations, then they'd hardly report it. Its not worthwhile, especially with a killer on the loose targeting NORD women. Nord Women have priority over what Galmar's Brother is doing, usually while drunk.

Isn't just Nord women, but women in general. I guess you're right, but it would be good to control the people who believe they're representing the Stormcloaks.

They're headquarters in Skyrim is Solitude, the Imperial Hub. The EETC would be funding the enemy war effort.

Nah, the headquarters is in Windhelm. Solitude is just the warehouse.


Back in Morrowind, the EETC didn't always equip their fighters in Imperial Armor. Its reliable, don't get me wrong, and I feel rather attractive to some, it just isn't good for business unless you have a little marking saying "Hey, I'm not with the Legion, this is EETC stuff right here".

You find people walking around with Imperial armor, mercenaries and what not. I know back in Morrowind they didn't wear it, but uniforms change over two hundred years. Probably was cost effective.


He was a double? :eek:

Yeah, has shorter messy hair and a beard. The Mottiere we first meet is clean shaven with long neat hair.


Ignoring that, I still call shenanigans on Jarls. In the grand scope of things, they aren't as important as Emperors or High Kings. They're local monarchs, but any say they have in something the Empire dictates is moot.

They may be local monarchs, but they can have say. Depends on who you know, who you befriend. Counts and Jarls can easily become political threats, or powerful. Kind of like that game, I can't remember what it is called, it is filled with political things... Crusader Kings? Or Crusades. I don't know.

Pretty sure I've mentioned before that they sent Tullius her way. An army a sheep lead by a lion is more dangerous than an army of lions lead by a sheep.

Jarls don't command the Legion. Besides, Elisif isn't a huge fan of Tullius. She bitches because he has authority over her.

So, then do you think that without Tullius in Solitude Ulfric would still lose?

Maybe, can't say how they'd fare in open battle. Tullius is just someone the Emperor tends to send to fix places quickly.

Might as well. You run into a LOT of them, most of the time they aren't even looking for you.

That is just the game randomly spawning them. I doubt they would have huge numbers.

You said Hammerfell is still friendly with the Imperials. Why can't they go through there? Skyrim isn't that important.

Marching through a desert wouldn't be that smart. Skyrim has Pale Pass, which allows large numbers of soldiers to pass into Skyrim/Cyrodiil and Morrowind I think.


Besides, you can't just leave the thread, never to respond again. There are many things you see and disagree with. Afterall, I had a nice short vacation before coming back and I saw you made a response or two after this post. I suspect you're not in this for the debate either, nor for the Imperials at this point. Just like me, you're in it... because you're in it.

What a blessed eternity, eh, Dear Mage? ;)

Cursed eternity. I could always use my Stormcloak account, but that would be unfair. Raijin and I kicked everyone's ass when I did that.
 

Ancano

High Justiciar
Sigh.

What a happy marriage this is,apparently. If we relate what's been going on in this thread to the Civil War in Skyrim, I can see clearly the Thalmor will have no problems whatsoever during the next great war.

We don't have to do anything really... you'll have destroyed each other long before the war even starts. ;)
 

Rimfaxe96

Well-Known Member
I learn new bits of lore all the time, Rimfaxe actually has more knowledge than I.

Yeah but I'm too lazy to bother with certain "arguments" people come up with.

Speaking of lore, even though I have barely any knowledge of Morrowind stuff I knew I've heard the name Divayth Fyr somewhere.
http://www.imperial-library.info/content/racial-motifs
He has his first appearance in the 2nd chapter about Dark Elves and continued presence in the later chapters. I don't know if he's cloned himself already back then but obviously he's always been a lady's man. Errr, elf. :p

Cursed eternity. I could always use my Stormcloak account, but that would be unfair. Raijin and I kicked everyone's ass when I did that.

And yet you shunned your Stormcloak-arguments with your Imperial-arguments. This civil war is as grey as it can get, as long as someone is capable of thinking outside the box you can always come up with new stuff. It's like an eternal wormhole in the Shivering Isles.

We don't have to do anything really... you'll have destroyed each other long before the war even starts. ;)

Awesome coincidence, I killed you and Estormo just yesterday in my latest playthrough.
And honestly? Having played the game Jak II: Renegade, it's so much fun playing the outcast in a dark world. So I'll admit that the gamer girl in me and the other girl with the streak for masochism, rawr, wouldn't mind being overthrown. Makes killing guards etc much happier and experimenting with illusion spells.
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
Yeah but I'm too lazy to bother with certain "arguments" people come up with.

I miss that one Stormcloak who said Imperials were hiding lore.

And yet you shunned your Stormcloak-arguments with your Imperial-arguments. This civil war is as grey as it can get, as long as someone is capable of thinking outside the box you can always come up with new stuff. It's like an eternal wormhole in the Shivering Isles.

Aye, the debate isn't so much between right and wrong or just facts. It is how you dress up your post and make your side look prettier.

I don't need to prove the Empire is the best choice, I just have to sell the idea.

the other girl with the streak for masochism, rawr, wouldn't mind being overthrown.

tumblr_m4hnefXuQh1qmiigzo1_250.gif
 
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Lewsean

Member
I learn new bits of lore all the time, Rimfaxe actually has more knowledge than I. Defending the Empire or the Stormcloaks isn't very hard, I can do both and have done in the past on my Stormcloak account.
This is why I think Bethesda's writing team did a great job, so many arguments for and against each side, I find my self questioning my decision at times.


As Brunwulf would say "The 'Great War'- there was nothing great about it. Thousands died on both sides and where did we end up? Did we really save the Empire or did we just plant the seeds for Ulfric's uprising and another war?"
This thing confuses me, it can't be hindsight because I view it by looking at the WGC.. It was OBVIOUSLY created just to weaken the Empire even more, and it was OBVIOUS what was going to happen in Skyrim.. So for the Empire to willingly sign it then be so surprised when the Civil War happened, it doesn't give me much faith in the current leaders of the Empire.

Maybe, depends how the Nords govern themselves regarding taxes. For all we know tax evasion could be the national sport of Jarls.
Not with Galmar Stone-Fist hanging around. :D

Talos makes the Thalmor seem nice. He wasn't kind, if he couldn't use he'd just kill you. Conquerer, slavery, tyrant. People loved him all the same. Helped with him and his dynasty making propaganda about stuff.
I don't agree, it was a means to an end, and at that time the end definitely justified the means. The state of Tamriel at that time made what Talos did seem like a blessing. The time under Tiber Septim was glorious.

That is just Nords, they're very superstitious people. Kind of sad to see them turn their backs on Mages and magic, it now being shunned and feared in parts.
They still have court wizard's, meaning they respect Magic and it's dangers. Over the past few centurys though, it's no surprise that some people have turned against Magic. So many terrible things have came from it.

Well I suppose they would. It is strange they're not worshipping Ysmir, makes me wonder how much influence the Imperial Cult and Talos Cult have had... Especially since I think a lot of things surrounding Talos were propaganda to help the Septims keep control over the Nords.

Same with the Divines and the merging of Mer/Nordic pantheons. Every Empire up until the Mede Dynasty has been smart enough to know that the Nords are the single most valuable ally to have.


Or luck. Some people are just unfortunately lucky, look at the many assassination attempts on Hitler.

Seems a bit too much for luck. He was only captured when Tullius took command, so we get the choices of; Thalmor, luck, Ulfric got owned by a better strategist.
This type of thing is Tullius' speciality. He said it him self he's the man the Emperor sends when things need fixing.

Or he jumps to the aid of his Legate, because he isn't a coward.

There are no good guys.
He sits on his chair hiding behind a lower-ranking woman and still has the nerve to ask for mercy with a sword at his throat, this type of man would never gain the respect of Skyrim.

Tullius executing Ulfric could lead to creating martyrs/retaliation.
My thought exactly at the start of the game, such a poor decision to execute a rebellion leader in some lowly Imperial fort. It's like Tullius thought to him self "hmm, how can I nearly guarantee the uprising of more Nords?"

Doubt the Nords would want to fight alongside many of those.
They have done for centurys.

People aren't bolted to the walls and the doors weigh tons rather than pounds. Fus Ro Dah is useful, but only against human opponents.
The Thu'um can actually re-shape Nirn, send formations of enemy soldiers the other way in fear, sharpen weapons, teleport the shouter, determine the weather etc etc.. It's basically the power of Kyne. The most powerful Magic in Tamriel.

They're headquarters in Skyrim is Solitude, the Imperial Hub. The EETC would be funding the enemy war effort.
Solitude is just a supply chain.
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
This is why I think Bethesda's writing team did a great job, so many arguments for and against each side, I find my self questioning my decision at times.

Aye, they make you stop and think about doing certain things.


This thing confuses me, it can't be hindsight because I view it by looking at the WGC.. It was OBVIOUSLY created just to weaken the Empire even more, and it was OBVIOUS what was going to happen in Skyrim.. So for the Empire to willingly sign it then be so surprised when the Civil War happened, it doesn't give me much faith in the current leaders of the Empire.

It isn't so much expecting no problems from the Concordat, there were issues within Cyrodiil. But the Nords were quiet for near three decades.

Not with Galmar Stone-Fist hanging around. :D

Could still be the sport, until you're found and get a beating. Smacking each other in Skyrim makes fast friends.

I don't agree, it was a means to an end, and at that time the end definitely justified the means. The state of Tamriel at that time made what Talos did seem like a blessing. The time under Tiber Septim was glorious.

Oh, of course they were glory days under his rule, he brought peace. He was widely loved by his subjects. Cruel to his enemies, good to his friends.

They still have court wizard's, meaning they respect Magic and it's dangers. Over the past few centurys though, it's no surprise that some people have turned against Magic. So many terrible things have came from it.

Court Wizards aren't always a large part of the scene, you have a few but generally they're only there to advise. The Nords don't respect magic as they used to, which is noted by Tsun the Nordic God.


Same with the Divines and the merging of Mer/Nordic pantheons. Every Empire up until the Mede Dynasty has been smart enough to know that the Nords are the single most valuable ally to have.

Titus Mede was loved by Skyrim, they wanted him and they backed him. Titus II made sacrifices he felt were needed to make peace. The Nords may have been unhappy like the rest of the Empire with the terms, but they still accepted them for a long time.

He sits on his chair hiding behind a lower-ranking woman and still has the nerve to ask for mercy with a sword at his throat, this type of man would never gain the respect of Skyrim.

Ulfric is sitting on his chair behind Galmar. He doesn't ask for mercy, he asks if he were to surrender which was a question that had to be asked. He's a career soldier, and a Military General when beaten in battle securing terms is norm.

He has the respect of many Nords, who believe in his leadership. Tullius faces death extremely well, he just says "So be it" that isn't begging or trying to get out of dying. He keeps his composure right up until the end.


My thought exactly at the start of the game, such a poor decision to execute a rebellion leader in some lowly Imperial fort. It's like Tullius thought to him self "hmm, how can I nearly guarantee the uprising of more Nords?"

Would have been worse to kill him inside the Imperial City at the order of the Emperor. Though I wasn't just talking about Ulfric being killed, his choice to execute Tullius is also poor especially when he would surrender. The Empire doesn't take kindly to the execution of their Generals. Kind of an invitation for all out war, he should have spared Tullius in aims of making peace with Cyrodiil.

The Legion is preparing to march into Skyrim from Cyrodiil once Pale Pass is cleared. The second time, I doubt they'll do the dance Tullius does with the Jarls and Moot.

Raijin thinks Tullius is the warmonger... He's rather peaceful in comparison to past Generals, the next guy could be like this:

Clear communication is the key to effective delivery of your point of view. A demand for surrender will be more effective if carried to the enemy by a headless corpse of one of their own tied to a horse. - Leadership Maxis

They have done for centurys.

Only in the Legion. Last time on their own it was with Breton Battlemages, and that didn't end well for the Mages.
 
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Ancano

High Justiciar
We don't have to do anything really... you'll have destroyed each other long before the war even starts. ;)

Awesome coincidence, I killed you and Estormo just yesterday in my latest playthrough.
And honestly? Having played the game Jak II: Renegade, it's so much fun playing the outcast in a dark world. So I'll admit that the gamer girl in me and the other girl with the streak for masochism, rawr, wouldn't mind being overthrown. Makes killing guards etc much happier and experimenting with illusion spells.


That was the other Ancano you killed. I'm the Ancano you didn't kill ;) Who is now the Arch Mage of the College. Beth uses a lot of 'ifs' for example, "If the Dragonborn became Arch Mage".

Honestly my dear, judging by the violence that's always accompanied this topic, I'd rather be the Outcast. Let them fight it out to whatever bitter end as there are other things in this world worth pursuing, wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid.

Payday 2 is a lot of fun. You should try it sometime. :)
 
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LegateFasendil

Imperial Legate
Soldiers, not true mages. for the true mage, Magic>politics or job.


Not so. Where did this come from?

Magic == Politics or Magic = Job because it's for some you can't have Politics or Job without Magic. Oblivion demonstrates this. Some are good in Speechcraft and others are better with Illusion which makes up for their lack of Speechcraft.

Your argument here is full of utopian bias and is not founded in lore or logic.

Let me prove it to you.

A Dunmer knows Destruction well. He becomes a soldier. When in a tight spot, he uses his powers to save his life and that of his comrades. Being a soldier does not stop him from being a mage or from using his magical talents.

Proof by Contradiction failed.

Again, MY system is about MY characters. Not a GENERAL stance. Will revise to be clearer, since people are mistaking what I am saying as a general opinion:
  • If MY characters are crusader-types, they would favor the Empire.
  • If MY characters are stealthy, the rebels
  • If MY characters are mages, they avoid the war just because.


Alright, alright, I see what you mean. Probably for the best. Your feelings on this are very similar to my stance on the Dragons. I stay - the hell - away from Bleak Falls until very late in the game.

To my sorrow, I have no interest in fighting Dragons at all, whatsoever, because it's too distracting.

Indeed, too many stupid things have happened. For example. One time I was making a run to Riften, had Lydia and all was well. That was a pretty solid game too. And then the deer and wolves and everyone started acting odd. So, knucklehead here, had to stop and investigate this unusual phenomenon. Then the large shadow covered the trees and the next thing I know, *BOOM* 4 ton dragon landed right on top of me, killing instantly.

Just dumb stuff like that or Dragons killing people I like or quest givers. It's all very annoying unfort.
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage

I have to wonder exactly how that Justiciar thought he'd be able to kill me, after I had defeated hordes of enemies and am holding an extremely powerful and legendary staff that once belonged to Magnus himself?

Talk about bringing a knife to a gun fight.
 

Rimfaxe96

Well-Known Member
I have to wonder exactly how that Justiciar thought he'd be able to kill me, after I had defeated hordes of enemies and am holding an extremely powerful and legendary staff that once belonged to Magnus himself?

Talk about bringing a knife to a gun fight.

Well, I guess it's because one of those two reasons:
1.) He really believed in the "Thalmor can't loose to anyone"
or 2.) Ancano never told him what kind of monsters you may meet in there (on the other hand, he does say "you made it out of there alive" so maybe he did but overestimated himself?)

Or perhaps he'd hoped you were already badly injured because of said monsters. Or pehaps he thought the player would be as easiy to kill as your regular Skyrim citizen like those they pick up from streets and houses at night...
Either way, he asked me 2 times for mercy and I ignored it. Shouldn't have been snooty and said "I'll let you live. This time." while I was checking out the bug in which he doesn't attack when you sheathe your weapons after his dialogue.
 

Ancano

High Justiciar
I have to wonder exactly how that Justiciar thought he'd be able to kill me, after I had defeated hordes of enemies and am holding an extremely powerful and legendary staff that once belonged to Magnus himself?

Talk about bringing a knife to a gun fight.

Well, I guess it's because one of those two reasons:
1.) He really believed in the "Thalmor can't loose to anyone"
or 2.) Ancano never told him what kind of monsters you may meet in there (on the other hand, he does say "you made it out of there alive" so maybe he did but overestimated himself?)

Or perhaps he'd hoped you were already badly injured because of said monsters. Or pehaps he thought the player would be as easiy to kill as your regular Skyrim citizen like those they pick up from streets and houses at night...
Either way, he asked me 2 times for mercy and I ignored it. Shouldn't have been snooty and said "I'll let you live. This time." while I was checking out the bug in which he doesn't attack when you sheathe your weapons after his dialogue.


Ancano already was an accomplished Mage in his own right, aside from himself being a High Ranking Dominion Officer. The fact he could 'interface' with the sphere regardless of the staff is incredible enough by itself. His demonstration of power both with and without the sphere was exemplary.

If you pay very close attention before the fight with him, Ancano paralyses Tolfdir? I think (been a while) and so he could have done the same to you. The thing you have to understand, is the Thalmor intend to 'prove' their superiority over man. And so, he allowed you to challenge him, not unlike what went down with High King Torygg and Jarl Ulfric Stormcloak.

He could have just paralyzed you right away. At least he gave you a chance to win. (Note to self* Next time paralyze everyone wielding a staff, right away and make off with magic 8 ball of doom.)

Personally, while you guys find his death entertaining, I find his persona rather intriguing. I don't see why it was necessary to kill him and the end battle with him is very easy if you use the staff. Very disappointing, but unfort I'm starting to get used to that.

Also, there are mods that change the outcome of that quest, allowing the possibility for Ancano to survive the encounter, including a mod which enables Ancano as a follower.

And this too - While we're at it, let's not forget that both Gen T and Ulfric die in their resp quest lines. If the Eye is never discovered, then Ancano walks away a free man. If he dies, it's questionable as to whether or not he's really dead because of what he did with the Eye. If the Eye has power to make one 'invincible', then anything's possible.
 
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Rimfaxe96

Well-Known Member
Ancano already was an accomplished Mage in his own right, aside from himself being a High Ranking Dominion Officer. The fact he could 'interface' with the sphere regardless of the staff is incredible enough by itself. His demonstration of power both with and without the sphere was exemplary.

If you pay very close attention before the fight with him, Ancano paralyses Tolfdir? I think (been a while) and so he could have done the same to you. The thing you have to understand, is the Thalmor intend to 'prove' their superiority over man. And so, he allowed you to challenge him, not unlike what went down with High King Torygg and Jarl Ulfric Stormcloak.

He could have just paralyzed you right away. At least he gave you a chance to win. (Note to self* Next time paralyze everyone wielding a staff, right away and make off with magic 8 ball of doom.)

Personally, while you guys find his death entertaining, I find his persona rather intriguing. I don't see why it was necessary to kill him and the end battle with him is very easy if you use the staff. Very disappointing, but unfort I'm starting to get used to that.

Also, there are mods that change the outcome of that quest, allowing the possibility for Ancano to survive the encounter, including a mod which enables Ancano as a follower.

And this too - While we're at it, let's not forget that both Gen T and Ulfric die in their resp quest lines. If the Eye is never discovered, then Ancano walks away a free man. If he dies, it's questionable as to whether or not he's really dead because of what he did with the Eye. If the Eye has power to make one 'invincible', then anything's possible.

I'm not doubting his skill as a mage - frankly, being a talented mage is the only thing that gets you into the Thalmor club;

Although I have not practiced in a long time I was once a wizard. Even when I was young my magic was undeniably powerful. It was that power that brought me to the attention of the Thalmor. In the Summerset Isles it is a great honor to be chosen to serve the Thalmor. -Runil

Should have paralyzed everyone, indeed. On the other hand, it wouldn't be a very great experience for the player to just lay there and watch him/herself being burned to ash. On the other hand, in the playthrough I mentioned above I'll admit I didn't kill him myself; those wisps/magic anomalies that came out of the Eye of Magnus just kept attacking him rather than me (I kept my distance from both of them though, so maybe that's why?).

The Eye might make you invincible, but probably only for a short while considering it grew unstable and had the potential to destroy Tamriel.
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
If you pay very close attention before the fight with him, Ancano paralyses Tolfdir? I think (been a while) and so he could have done the same to you. The thing you have to understand, is the Thalmor intend to 'prove' their superiority over man. And so, he allowed you to challenge him, not unlike what went down with High King Torygg and Jarl Ulfric Stormcloak.

He could have just paralyzed you right away. At least he gave you a chance to win. (Note to self* Next time paralyze everyone wielding a staff, right away and make off with magic 8 ball of doom.)

The Thalmor are just arrogant to the extreme. That will be their undoing. They make enemies at every turn, and they will always underestimate mankind.

His actions were nothing about having some honorable challenge, he went insane. Screaming things like "You will not take this from me!" "The Eye is mine!" and the death scream of "Noooo"

He's nothing short of your comical moustache twirling villain.
 

Rimfaxe96

Well-Known Member
His actions were nothing about having some honorable challenge, he went insane. Screaming things like "You will not take this from me!" "The Eye is mine!" and the death scream of "Noooo"

You forgot

You dare challenge me?
I cannot be defeated!
My power is supreme!
You dare approach me here? Are you mad? You cannot hope to defeat me!
Die, worm!
Now you die!
You cannot escape!
I will end you!
Die, insect!
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
You forgot

You dare challenge me?
I cannot be defeated!
My power is supreme!
You dare approach me here? Are you mad? You cannot hope to defeat me!
Die, worm!
Now you die!
You cannot escape!
I will end you!
Die, insect!

Bet he was foaming at the mouth too.
 

Ancano

High Justiciar
Ancano already was an accomplished Mage in his own right, aside from himself being a High Ranking Dominion Officer. The fact he could 'interface' with the sphere regardless of the staff is incredible enough by itself. His demonstration of power both with and without the sphere was exemplary.

If you pay very close attention before the fight with him, Ancano paralyses Tolfdir? I think (been a while) and so he could have done the same to you. The thing you have to understand, is the Thalmor intend to 'prove' their superiority over man. And so, he allowed you to challenge him, not unlike what went down with High King Torygg and Jarl Ulfric Stormcloak.

He could have just paralyzed you right away. At least he gave you a chance to win. (Note to self* Next time paralyze everyone wielding a staff, right away and make off with magic 8 ball of doom.)

Personally, while you guys find his death entertaining, I find his persona rather intriguing. I don't see why it was necessary to kill him and the end battle with him is very easy if you use the staff. Very disappointing, but unfort I'm starting to get used to that.

Also, there are mods that change the outcome of that quest, allowing the possibility for Ancano to survive the encounter, including a mod which enables Ancano as a follower.

And this too - While we're at it, let's not forget that both Gen T and Ulfric die in their resp quest lines. If the Eye is never discovered, then Ancano walks away a free man. If he dies, it's questionable as to whether or not he's really dead because of what he did with the Eye. If the Eye has power to make one 'invincible', then anything's possible.

I'm not doubting his skill as a mage - frankly, being a talented mage is the only thing that gets you into the Thalmor club;

Although I have not practiced in a long time I was once a wizard. Even when I was young my magic was undeniably powerful. It was that power that brought me to the attention of the Thalmor. In the Summerset Isles it is a great honor to be chosen to serve the Thalmor. -Runil

Should have paralyzed everyone, indeed. On the other hand, it wouldn't be a very great experience for the player to just lay there and watch him/herself being burned to ash. On the other hand, in the playthrough I mentioned above I'll admit I didn't kill him myself; those wisps/magic anomalies that came out of the Eye of Magnus just kept attacking him rather than me (I kept my distance from both of them though, so maybe that's why?).

The Eye might make you invincible, but probably only for a short while considering it grew unstable and had the potential to destroy Tamriel.


Nice post. Kept your distance huh? lolz Yeah I'd think you'd have to in a situation like that. Scenarios of this nature are why firearms were invented, I believe.
 

Rimfaxe96

Well-Known Member
Bet he was foaming at the mouth too.

What about the crazy eyes?

crazyEyes.gif


Nice post. Kept your distance huh? lolz Yeah I'd think you'd have to in a situation like that. Scenarios of this nature are why firearms were invented, I believe.

Nah, I didn't have to. But 4 of those buggers ganged up on him before I even had a chance to cross the room, so I just stood back and watched them fight it out.
Firearms and TGM mode. ;)
 

Ancano

High Justiciar
If you pay very close attention before the fight with him, Ancano paralyses Tolfdir? I think (been a while) and so he could have done the same to you. The thing you have to understand, is the Thalmor intend to 'prove' their superiority over man. And so, he allowed you to challenge him, not unlike what went down with High King Torygg and Jarl Ulfric Stormcloak.

He could have just paralyzed you right away. At least he gave you a chance to win. (Note to self* Next time paralyze everyone wielding a staff, right away and make off with magic 8 ball of doom.)

The Thalmor are just arrogant to the extreme. That will be their undoing. They make enemies at every turn, and they will always underestimate mankind.

His actions were nothing about having some honorable challenge, he went insane. Screaming things like "You will not take this from me!" "The Eye is mine!" and the death scream of "Noooo"

He's nothing short of your comical moustache twirling villain.


Wait just a min there Mr Eastwood. Didn't you say something a while back about Mage's being detached from people? To the point where they are perceived as being insane? I haven't read everything on here however seem to remember something about that.

Besides, if you were treated as bad as Ancano was, like an outsider, and later on had an opportunity to get your hands on a magic 8 ball in the sky that grants unlimited wishes and some smarta$$ noob was trying to take it away from you, you may go a little insane yourself. If you cared enough that is. ;)
 

Ancano

High Justiciar
You forgot

You dare challenge me?
I cannot be defeated!
My power is supreme!
You dare approach me here? Are you mad? You cannot hope to defeat me!
Die, worm!
Now you die!
You cannot escape!
I will end you!
Die, insect!

Bet he was foaming at the mouth too.


That was a water breathing spell actually. You see, the Eye granted invincibility which includes being able to breath underwater. :cool:
 

DrunkenMage

Intoxicated Arch-Mage
Wait just a min there Mr Eastwood. Didn't you say something a while back about Mage's being detached from people? To the point where they are perceived as being insane? I haven't read everything on here however seem to remember something about that.

Besides, if you were treated as bad as Ancano was, like an outsider, and later on had an opportunity to get your hands on a magic 8 ball in the sky that grants unlimited wishes and some smarta$$ noob was trying to take it away from you, you may go a little insane yourself. If you cared enough that is. ;)

There is detached, and then there is crazy son of a bitch who nearly destroys the world because they were dicking around with something they don't understand or could properly control. He went power crazy, doubt he was even thinking about the Thalmor at this point.

It isn't that he's treated bad, he keeps himself distant from the Mages. He doesn't trust them, and spied on them. The Thalmor are enemies with the Psijic Order, simply because they have power and will not be controlled.
 

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